Forums IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ Beyond Human Learning within a dream..?

Hey everyone,

I know this may sound kinda wacky but I just had a thought about how to learn within a dream. Since the mind can't tell the difference between physical reality and mental reality, I was wondering if the brain still continues to connect neurons even while sleeping? For example, I love violin! So if I wanted to learn within my dream perhaps I can use a paraliminal to program my mind to play only violin within my dreams. If im correct then four hours of playing within my dream should help me within my physical reality. Law of reinforcement would connect new pathways within my mind to help me play violin better next time. I know this sounds wacky but I was just wondering if this is possible??

--Richard

Hey everyone,

I just asked a professor this same question and I found that yes it's possible. Even when you sleep your neurons are still active! And since the mind can't tell the difference between physical reality and mental reality, your mental reality does affect your neurons just like how your physical reality would. From this you can build long term relationships within the brain even while you sleep through Law of Reinforcement. So I suppose if you can control your dream enough and play violin for four hours within a dream, your neurons will continue to have a longer and stronger relationship. So four hours of practice within a dream would be the same as four hours of practice in the physical reality!!!!

In theory it sounds good........

Most dreams last only a few minutes - occasionally you might get a really interesting one that will last up to 15 or 20 minutes IF you are able to take control. So what you might end up with, IF you are able to program precisely enough, is a series of dream "practices". BUT sometimes we are dreaming up to three or four (even more) dreams at the same time, and that is why things seem so jumbled to us. To achieve the kind of clearness of purpose needed to do four hours of steady dreaming would mean you'd probably be past the need of dreaming about doing it anyways.

I remember when I was a kid doing a lot of piano concerts, I'd end up dreaming about the concerts the night before - usually ended up with my teacher (an Ursuline Nun, in long flowing black robes and tradition head-gear) chasing me off the stage with her pointer. Not much practising there....

Cheers!
Unis

I am posting a link to an article about learning while dreaming.

http://www.unknowncountry.com/news/?id=6197

I believe that there are sections about this in two of Stephen LaBerge's books on Lucid Dreaming. I remember reading accounts of how dreaming had helped individuals reach higher levels of performance.

If I recall correctly, REM sleep is necessary for the formation of long-term memory. It's uncanny how when something goes into procedural memory through repetition, you often dream of doing it over and over again in your sleep.

I don't see any reason why practicing something in your dreams wouldn't help with acquiring various levels of skill. The only thing I would worry about in that regard is that the kind of feedback you receive will not be coming from the world but from your internal model of the world.

For golf, for instance, when you golf in the real world, you adapt your behavior based on real conditions, and so improvement in the real world is possible. But in dreams, there is no reality, no gravity, wind conditions, etc., to "respond" to your actions, so while you may learn how to golf better with dreams, you may not be learning how to golf better in reality... if you catch my meaning.

I've tried reading books in dreams. What a nightmare. The text changes.... it's like trying to walk uphill on a world with increased gravity while it's raining and there is a mudslide coming down from above.

Recent research in the University in Germany that studies sleep and it's impact on learning and memory found that your learning cycle is strongest during non-REM sleep.

They taught people and gave them a cue... a pleasant smell. They gave a burst of the smell during the subjects sleep cycles and watched what happened in the brain. The same neurons started firing that they were using during learning. They found the brain was more responsive during non-REM and follow up testing indicated that those who had the smell cued during that time did better than those who received the cue during the REM cycle. The test had something to do with memory.

Sorry I read this late last year and that what I remember about it. It's interesting but useless in the sense you need to be in a lab to check you are cuing yourself during a non-REM cycle. So I'm not going to hunt for it for you. While I probably saved the bookmark I discovered backing up your computer doesn't help much with certain software. [The side effects of manifesting something within 24 hours of having the thought I'd really like to upgrade to a faster computer]

Alex

That is interesting, Alex.

My recall of REM sleep being important for long term memory formation was from something where a person was deprived of REM sleep for extended periods and it started interfering with their ability to learn.

My memory of the details is foggy as well. Hehehe. Whatever the case, it looks like we both could use a little more non-REM or REM sleep, whichever the case may be.

True. I had no intention of ever doing more than watchy what develops. For personal use iI remembered what I wanted to remember. since had no practical application outside a laboratory set-up other than to say... Don't deprive yourself of sleep if you're studying and want to remember what you learned.

I have come across similar studies about REM sleep. I think they were surprised to find it happened during non REM because of the effects on memory already reported.. More and more I learn that we need more sleep not less. Especially with the fast pace at which we live these days.

Alex