Posted By: rhammond2k Lotus Sutra - 07/17/03 08:29 PM
Fellow Truth Seekers,

Thanks to Photoreading and other LSC methodologies, I have been able to read prolifically on a variety of topics. Most recently, the works of Dr. David Hawkins, including Power vs Force, The Eye of the Eye, and I:Reality and Subjectivity (see: www.veritaspub.com. Dr. Hawkins's work has been most transformative in my experience.

In a recent lecture in Sedona, Arizona, Hawkins calibrates the Lotus Sutra at over 730 on the Scale of Consciousness (see
http://www.dowsers.info/map.htm )

The Lotus Sutra (see http://www.buddhistdoor.com/passissue/9708/sources/lotus1.htm is said to be "the Buddha's ultimate teaching i.e.
the most final Dharma, containing his final revelation on the
universality of salvation, the true nature of Buddhahood, and the
best and universally applicable means of attaining Buddhahood."

Some say the chanting of the Lotus Sutra can lead to enlightenment.

Does anybody have any experience or comments on this practice?

Peace,

Robert


[This message has been edited by rhammond2k (edited July 17, 2003).]

[This message has been edited by rhammond2k (edited July 17, 2003).]





Posted By: Heartbeat Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/22/03 10:38 PM
Robert:

I am reading Power vs Force now. Have you tried the kinesiology test? It seems so simple yet I wonder if it takes considerable practice to be accurate. I wonder about variables such as moods and how they can affect outcome of the testing. Thanks







Posted By: rhammond2k Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/23/03 03:36 PM
There are some variables in using Applied Kinesiology. Foremost is that the individuals using it must calibrate at 200 or above Level of Consciousness (LOC). Music in the background, preconceived ideas, and the specific wording of the statement are among some of the other factors to consider.

FAQs About Kinesiology
This document addresses Frequently Asked Questions about kinesiology. It draws from
the writings and talks of Dr. Hawkins on the topic.
Q: What exactly is kinesiology, and how does it work?
A: Kinesiology is a way of testing muscle strength in the physical body to determine a
response to an inquiry. Most commonly, it involves two people, a tester and a
subject, and uses the deltoid muscle of the subject’s shoulder to ascertain the
response. Demonstrations of Dr. Hawkins conducting kinesiologic testing may be
seen in his two-volume video tape entitled “Power vs. Force.”
Dr. Hawkins states that kinesiology really does only one thing: it detects truth or its
absence.
Q: Dr. Hawkins suggests in Power vs. Force that kinesiology is a tool available to
everyone. Does it, in fact, work equally well for all people?
A: In his June 2002 lecture in Sedona, Dr. Hawkins stated that about 10% of the general
population cannot do kinesiology at all, because of imbalances in their chi energy.
Beyond that, keep in mind also that Dr. Hawkins has also indicated in his lectures
that only people in integrity — that is, those who calibrate above 200 on his Map of
Consciousness — may expect to have reliable results with kinesiology. (This means
both the tester and the subject.) Since only 22% of the earth’s population calibrates
above 200 at present, most people on the planet will not be able to use it reliably.
For those in integrity, there are several factors that may impact consistently reliable
results.
2
Q: What are those factors?
A: They include the following:
§ The intention of the question is paramount. It, like the persons doing the testing,
must be above 200 on Dr. Hawkins’ Consciousness scale.
§ Ask permission to do a calibration. (Make a statement such as, “We have
permission to ask about this,” and once you have a positive response, then test
your statement.)
§ The person must be prepared to deal with the answer to his/her question. (This
matter may be handled by the asking of permission.)
§ Remove jewelry, watches, eyeglasses, if they appear to make a difference in your
results.
§ Don’t listen to music while calibrating. Avoid visual distractions; some imagery
may affect results.
§ Use as little pressure as necessary to detect a response in the subject’s arm. The
subject needs to resist with only enough resistance to counter the downward
pressure.
§ Look for internal consistency. (Responses should be uniformly consistent within
yourself and with the frame of reference of Dr. Hawkins’ Map.)
§ While it’s possible to do kinesiologic testing by yourself, Dr. Hawkins advises to
do it with another person, particularly for very important issues.
§ Do the thymic thump if you seem to be getting continuous errors. (The thymic
thump is a stimulation of the thymus gland. The thump is done by lightly
thumping the area over the top portion of the breast bone with your fist, while
thinking of something positive, smiling, and saying “Ha” with each thump. Do
three thumps in rapid succession three times (total of nine thumps).
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§ Be sure you’re calibrating in reference to Dr. Hawkins’ Map of Consciousness. In
the beginning, it’s helpful, as Dr. Hawkins writes, to specify the key threshold
levels of the Map to ensure that you’re connected to its frames of reference.
§ It can take time to develop accuracy and consistency with kinesiology. Be patient.
§ Calibrations should be done using statements, not questions.
§ Ask only about things that exist now or in the past (not the future).
Q: Why don’t I get the same results in my calibrations as Dr. Hawkins?
A: Dr. Hawkins has done close to 300,000 different calibrations over decades. He has
stated that after doing these for so long, one develops a fabric of understanding
about one’s area of research. Remember that his experience gives him a unique
proficiency with kinesiology. Rather than attempt to replicate his results, it can be
more useful to focus on issues and concerns more immediate to your needs.
Q: Is there any one factor more important than any other in kinesiology?
A: Dr. Hawkins’ writings and talks point to intention as paramount, as stated earlier.
Dr. Hawkins refers to the benefit of having a deep love for truth (May 2002 lecture).
In doing kinesiology, more than wanting to have consistently reliable results, more
than wanting to establish corroborative findings, more than wanting the tool of
kinesiology to perform in a certain way, it may be more helpful instead to focus on
what it is that the tool detects.
Q: Is kinesiology impacted by the level of consciousness of the tester? For example,
could someone calibrating at 400 get a different number or answer than someone
calibrating at 205?
A: Generally, no — however, it does happen when the subjective meaning of the
statement differs to people of different levels. For instance, what is meant by “good”
4
for people? Does it mean gain? Health? Success? Or love and power? Greater
specificity in the statement brings more accurate answers.

Peace,

Robert

[This message has been edited by rhammond2k (edited July 23, 2003).]





Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/23/03 06:56 PM
Robert,

Cant get to that link. Is it correct?

Shr33m has some experience with calibrating ... hoping he/she will comment.

Heartbeat, it mentions in P vs F that you can make the person go strong again or prep them or something to that degree, by having them close eyes, concentrate on something that represents good (god, budda ...), smile and tap the thymus gland area (near the collar bone - the U shaped area.


Love and Light

Michael Saikali






Posted By: Heartbeat Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/23/03 08:08 PM
Michael:

I am about half way through the book, and it is blowing me away. Hopefully, I can learn the kinesiology method of calibrating. How long did you practice before you felt confident with it? Do you use his specific method of kinesiology or have you branched out and use other methods? I have read of one method where you hold an object or think of the subject. If your body leans forward, that is a yes, if it leans backward, that is a no.

Take care.






Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/23/03 11:14 PM
Heartbeat,

I too just finished the PvsF book and reading the Eye of the I ... excellent stuff!

Yesterday I get a call from a Commodities person asking if I want to invest and he says "Investing will help you to retire early" ... "I think, the only thing that will help me to retire early is death, realizing that his response is ego centered and mine was Self centered."

Eye of the I has a chart showing L of C and my eyes seemed to wonder to the Inspiring level of 310. I don't know for a fact if this is the level I calibrate at but intuition guided me to that line of the chart for some time. I still have MUCH work to do to climb the latter of consciousness!

Eye of I goes a bit further into LOC and actually adds to PvsF. Sort of picks up where PvsF finishes.

love and light

michael Saikali





Posted By: Heartbeat Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/23/03 11:50 PM
Hi Michael:

Sounds good to me. Looks like that will be my next book. Thanks for the info.





Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/24/03 04:01 AM
To calibrate a numerical value on the logarithmic LoC scale use the binary search algorithm. Start at the midpoint say 500 and test if it's over that amount. If so pick the midpoint between 500 and 1000 and test again. If not, pick the midpoint between 1 and 500 and test if it's over 250. And so on, until you get it down to a specific value. It's more efficient than a sequential linear search for most incremental values of N.

An interesting book on muscle testing is "The Truth Reflex" by Dr. Sally St. John. You can get it at her web site
http://www.sallystjohn.com/truthereflex_details.html

She also has a video available if you are predominantly the visual processing type.

Before running the procedure it's a good idea to correct for psychological reversal (or reversed polarity) using techniques from EFT.

More detailed techniques on correcting your energy polarity can be found in Donna Eden's book called "Energy Medicine" and she has some really excellent videos. Check it out at
http://www.innersource.net/energy_medicine/energy_medicine_main.htm

I highly recommend her book to get a good understanding of the human energy system.

shr33m






Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 05:29 AM
Shr33m,

Apparently, Donna Edan has several Videos ... any in particular that received your excellent stamp of approval???

I was thinking Donnas' book, intro video and 6 hour training. Unless you know of another video program she offers that I should look into?


Love and Light

Michael Saikali






Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/24/03 09:00 PM
Michael,

Definitely get Donna's book. If you have the 6 hour 3-video tape set, that should suffice. But if you want the intro video, I wont stop you.







Posted By: rhammond2k Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/24/03 11:16 PM
Dr. Hawkins also describes a Spritual Emergency technique in his
latest book, "I: Reality and Subjectivity" (see http://veritaspub.com/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=105) which consists of picturing someone you love,
tapping the thymus point (top of the chest, below the collar bone),
breathing, visualizing energy rising along the chakras, and
saying "OM."

Peace,

Robert






Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 12:40 AM
Robert,

Haven't gotton that far yet ... in fact I'm in the process of SR and dipping PvsF and Eye of I ...

These books definately deserve much attention from the i!

Love and Light

Michael Saikali





Posted By: Heartbeat Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 01:48 AM
Shr33m:

Isn't it a coincidence you mentioned the book Energy Medicine by Edens. I just started reading it too. All this information, so little time. Wouldn't it be nice if after reading Eye of the I and Reality and Subj., our consciousness racked up some more points?!





Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 02:43 AM
Heartbeat,

Just order the book/videos ... from your initial preview, waht does the overall content/structure of the book feel/look/read like?

Love and Light,

Michael Saikali

PS - Shr33m, Robert and heartbeat, give me a chance to catch up on the reading ... after all, my books have to travel many miles before I can actually touch them!





Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 02:43 AM
Heartbeat,

You could Photoread the books but I think they have to be savored, word by word.

You can read about the 59 benefits of reading Power vs Force at http://veritaspub.com/article_info.php?cArticlePath=1&articles_id=3&osCsid=e23a465ee289f5ef7bf49db08bd6ec49

"On the referenced Scale of the Levels of Consciousness, which calibrates the levels of Truth from I to 1,000, Power vs Force calibrates at 850, The Eye of the I at 980, and the final volume of the trilogy, I, calibrates at a conclusive 999.8."

The Donna Eden book is just super-packed with so much useful information. They could easily have made it into multiple volumes. For the price it is a real bargain for what you can get out of it.

I've been trying out the Accutone CDs which are based on Attractor Field Therapy from Dr. Hawkins' books for several weeks now and I'm going to see how it goes for the next few months.
http://4optimallife.com/Accutone-CD-Attractor-Field-Therapy.html

shr33m






Posted By: Michael Saikali Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 12:06 PM
I guess I have much to look forward to when Donna's book/videos arrive.

I'll let you know my thoughts on the videos after I watch them.

Love and Light

Michael Saikali





Posted By: Heartbeat Re: Lotus Sutra - 07/25/03 12:59 PM
Shr33m:

I went to the optimallife site. The CD's sound intriguing so keep us posted on how these work for you. Thanks.







Posted By: rhammond2k Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/01/03 04:56 PM
Dr. Hawkins calibrates Jesus, Buddha and Krishna at LOC 1000. He calibrates Mahayana Buddhism at 950. He calibrates the Lotus Sutra, which are the final words of the Buddha at over 730.


Peace,

Robert

[This message has been edited by rhammond2k (edited May 17, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by rhammond2k (edited May 17, 2004).]





Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/01/03 09:08 PM
The Nichiren sect of Buddhism was formed in 13th Century Japan by Nichiren Daishonin and is an interpretation of the Lotus Sutra of Mahayana Buddhism.

Dr. Hawkins has calibrated Mahayana Buddhism and the Lotus Sutra. The question I'd ask is, how does he calibrate Nichiren Buddhism (or more specifically the SGI group which spun off the Nichiren group), their gongyo practice and the nam-myoho-renge-kyo chant?

Certainly there are many ways to raise one's LoC. What is the best way? Should we just calibrate each teacher, group, teaching ourselves? Good questions, them all.

[This message has been edited by shr33m (edited August 01, 2003).]





Posted By: bhenry Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/02/03 12:58 AM
Shr33m, what are your opinions of the Nicheran sect particularly the SGI-USA? I live in NYC where the main headquarters are located and I also have close friends that are members of this group. Honestly, I am not very impressed with this sect of Buddhism, I often think it is a westernized version of Buddhism that does not stress much discipline. I have been to a few of the meetings and it seems as if the chanting is used primarly as a means of manifesting things that are wanted in life. It almost comes across as promoting a kind of magical thinking mentality, I have a hard time accepting this kind of approach to life. In other words, all I have to do is chant and some how life will produce what I desire. I personally prefer the philosophy of the Tibetan systems of Buddhism over SGI-USA. The Tibetan systems of Buddhims tend to stress the importance of finding inner peace and happiness. I was thinking of looking further into this, maybe I will in the future.





Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/02/03 03:03 AM
The Nichiren sect's aims are to remove karma and attain buddhahood. Whether they achieve either of these goals remains to be seen. There's nothing wrong with spiritual people becoming materially well off, as long as they don't degenerate into pure materialism. At least they could have more time to pursue spirituality without worrying about paying the bills. Controlling the ego can be a problem.

Tibetan Buddhism came directly from India and retains much of the original Buddhism, moreso than the Buddhism in China and Japan. Tibetan Buddhists fled their country when the Chinese Communists took over and most of them live in India. I've had great experiences with Tibetan Buddhist monks.

Remember that Buddhism came from India and borrows many of the concepts and practices from Vedic religions such as chanting. You seem draw to the Tibetan tradition and that may very well be more suited to you.







Posted By: bhenry Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/03/03 07:19 PM
Shr33m, my reason for stating that some of the members of the Nichiren sect of SGI tend to buy into a kind of magical thinking belief is because many of them rely exclusively on chanting Nam-myoho-renge-kyo as a way of attaining what they want. In many cases I have not seen the results that they claim this sacred mantra is capable of producing. If all a person does is chant but has poor skills in constructing an action plan and does not take action, I believe the chances of achieving the desired goal is very slim. I definitely agree that having money can be an asset in living a spiritual life. There is nothing wrong with being wealthy. Maybe I'm a cynic but I think that relying exclusively on chanting to become financially successful is even worse than playing the Lotto every week and believing this will get you to become a millionaire one day. Just my opinion.





Posted By: shr33m Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/03/03 09:37 PM
bhenry,

agreed. no one should rely on chanting alone if the goal is as lofty as enlightenment. i like to be skeptical of anyone's claims, and i would never put all of my eggs in one basket. besides chanting there is the acquisition of knowledge of the essence of the teachings, devotional practice and surrender to the divine, releasing attachments, meditation, satsang, darshan with a genuine master. mantras are often a form of prayer (to whom is often a good question) which you could spend a lifetime or so reciting but are not absolutely necessary for everyone.







Posted By: rhammond2k Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/04/03 04:45 PM
Thanks for your replies. I am also looking into Tibetan Buddhism. Just read "How to Practice" by The Dalai Lama last night. Found it quite fascinating. It appears that Tibetan Buddhism is similar to Mahayana Buddhism in the belief that one can become enlightened in this lifetime. They emphasize the mantra: OM MANE PADME HUM, which is loosely translated as the jewel in the center of the lotus. Here's another interesting website:
http://dharma-haven.org/tibetan/meaning-of-om-mani-padme-hung.htm

Peace,

Robert





Posted By: rhammond2k Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/20/03 09:48 PM
I just photoread "The Lotus Sutra" (Burton Watson translation)... several times through.. followed by "The Bhagavad Gita"...

Coming from a mostly Christian background, it is interesting to let go of positionalities and expand the awareness of divinity/consciousness...

As A Course in Miracles says, "I am beginning to see things differently."

This journey is truly amazing.

Peace,

Robert





Posted By: Kristoff Olafsson Re: Lotus Sutra - 08/28/03 01:18 AM
Enlightenment...is not this or that. Enlightenment does not calibrate to a scale; it does not lie in books. You don't need a master, besides the Master. There is nothing the matter, so to with enlightenment then!
If you wish for enlightenment you must enter within- into the moment of raw experience. You must enter into it so thoroughly that you are 'never' unsettled. When your mind wrestles with the greatest of problems, when you enter into experience these problems dissolve. Follow this for enlightenment- the quest for enlightenment will come to fruition when you no longer seek it, but live it! It is here with you now, underneath your keyboard. There, you can find it! Forget scales, teachers, mudras, sutras and mantras- the Great Man simply abides in the Great Thoroughfare. But yet continue your practises, they will reap some benefit, and, possibly enlightenment. The revelation is yours- in you it begins and terminates, not in the practises. If your mind thinks of anything but the raw truth of experience- as I have tried to convey it-: such thoughts as, "he must be confused", "I cannot understand, so I may as well continue with what Im doing", you may be right! But the intellective meaning-imputer to those statements is wrong. The existential ortho-ontological experientially-acquiesced ranceur most assuredly pontificates in a deconstructionist aporia! Now, there, in that moment of confusion, enter it and really see the mind which you must abandon!
For this your books are truly useless.

Kristoff "Guerilla-illuminater" Olafsson






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