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Joined: Mar 2004
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Yep It's New Years here. 4am almost. Some things to finish up and I'm heading to bed.
All the best for 2007.
Alex
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Happy New Year all!
I'm new to the forum and to paraliminals. I received a set of 4 for Christmas, and have been experimenting. One of them is the New History Generator, which is causing me some pain.
My problem is that it relies heavily on visualization, which is a very weak area for me. I hate to admit it but I am 99% occluded in visualization. I am very experienced with yoga, meditation, breathwork, etc. But when I have to rely on visualization I am stumped and frustrated.
I am definitely oriented toward kinesthetic and auditory type work. I guess what I am looking for is some input before I throw in the towel and return this particular CD.
Any thoughts anyone?
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Hi Jagadish, "My problem is that it relies heavily on visualization, which is a very weak area for me. I hate to admit it but I am 99% occluded in visualization. I am very experienced with yoga, meditation, breathwork, etc. But when I have to rely on visualization I am stumped and frustrated." "Any thoughts anyone?" A couple of thoughts occur to me. But first I have to admit that I've not used the New History Generator paraliminal, so I don't know where abouts in that CD the need to visualisation occurs, so my comments may not be 100% relevant. One of my points is: you may feel that you are a poor visualiser, but the paraliminals are so well-crafted that they may help you to visualise more easily than you think you can - for example, the use of the holosynch binaural beats, the voices simultanously into the left and right ears, the well-crafted language, may all help to lead you into a state where you find you can visualise more than easily than you could without it. So why not try it a few more times but instead of entering the experience with the thought "This isn't going to work for me because I can't visualise...", take with you the thought "I wonder how much this amazing CD will help me to visualise as much as I need to in order to get something valuable from the experience" or some such. Do you see what I mean? There's a danger you may be shutting down your ability to fully respond to the CD by prejudging that it can't possibly work with you, when perhaps ... it can! [I base that partly on your comment "when I have to rely on visualization I am stumped and frustrated"] The other thing is: you say "I am 99% occluded in visualization." as though that is a fixed, given property within you that you are just stuck with. But suppose it's not?! Suppose there are things you can do that will improve your ability to visualize? The folks at Project Renaissance certainly think there are: http://www.winwenger.com/index.htmLearning Strategies' Genius Code course takes these techniques and weaves them together into an excellent package. But the thing is, you can learn by just practicing what's there, for free, on the Project Renaissance site. I've been practising this stuff, and have been getting some small but encouraging results; like you, I have seen myself [ha!] as a poor visualiser - but that seems to be changing. A quote from Win Wenger's Project Renaisance site: "Tesla used visual thinking to make his discoveries. Legendary in his own time, Tesla's [celebrated] ability to picture a new machine in its entirety in his own mind, and to "set it running" there in his mind in order to discover where it would wear and so how to compensate, is now a teachable/learnable skill here at Project Renaissance." Now there's a bold claim! i hope you check it out! regards, Marc
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Joined: Apr 2005
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The major problem I have with these techniques from the Win Wenger web-site and his "Think Visually" booklet that accompanies The Genius Code, is it that most of them require using a partner, either present or on the end of a phone line. I have availability to neither resource - none of my friends (or family for sure, for that matter) will participate in these sorts of things, especially for the length of time it would be necessary to work with me on these to accomplish anything. I fully understand your frustration, Jagadish. My own very brief and rare visualizations (with eyes closed) are months apart, and usually I need to be almost asleep before they happen (bordering dreamland). These mostly occur at the very end of using Holosync, and generally take me off into some sort of out-of-body/lucid dreaming experience. I never get visualizations in deep meditation, as Alex (on a previous thread, I think) had suggested should be happening. Just blackness! Having used New History Generator, while I didn't get any visualized sense of anything happening, I just relax and hope like heck that the sub-conscious mind isn't as blind as I seem to be. I rely more on my feelings about what has happened than any visual form of them. I find, in order to benefit from any of the Paraliminals, I must use them many time consecutively over a couple of weeks, and if I miss a few days, well, it takes just that much longer. I think this relates more into another post, though, about knowing too much about the hypnosis and NLP parts, and somehow I'm blocked by a sub-conscious mind/inner child that is really too wise-a$$ for it's own good!  I am curently working on using a form of hypnosis where the eyes are allowed to remain open, with normal blinking, to see if I can somehow use that with the paraliminals. I seem to be able to conceptualize in my mind with my eyes open very well - it's closing the eyes that is the problem. Unis
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Hi Unis, Did you see my response to your post on the "Sonic Access vs Holosynch" thread? At: http://www.learningstrategies.com/forum/...age=1#Post58007You may have read it and got nothing out of it, but IF you haven't seen it, please please please do check it out, and you might find something useful in it. Unis wrote: "The major problem I have with these techniques ... is it that most of them require using a partner, either present or on the end of a phone line." That's the ideal,but Win does say, on the genius code CDs, that you can kind of imagine him to be present and do the image-streaming to the imagined 'him' in the room. I think that as long as you are describing what's going on in a way that would be intelligible to a real listener (rather than just degenerating into a drunken-sounding shapeless ramble), then the process will serve its purpose of drawing stuff from the inner mind across the developing bridge, to the conscious mind. regards, Marc
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@ Decision2change:
(using paraliminals while doing things?)
I think that it may have been other products that I was referring to. Or perhaps I was trying to use paraliminals while doing breakfast, etc. I'd not recommend it today. Unless you've got no time at all and wont do the paraliminals unless. And then, perhaps, it is even more important to just lay down for a spell... : D
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Quote:
Hi Unis,
Did you see my response to your post on the "Sonic Access vs Holosynch" thread?
You may have read it and got nothing out of it, but IF you haven't seen it, please please please do check it out, and you might find something useful in it.
Well, yes, and I had mentioned it in your thread last week over on the CRI df as well. It appears that you get far more visually (from what you describe of your 'beginnings' with the GC stuff) than I have since before my father bashed my head into the floor nearly 40 years ago. Just before that (as a young woman), that was the last time I had anything I could call "visualization on demand". I had a serious concussion then, but since they didn't routinely do MRI's back then, as they probably didn't have the technology, I'm thinking there might be some brain damage.
Quote:
Unis wrote:
"The major problem I have with these techniques ... is it that most of them require using a partner, either present or on the end of a phone line."
That's the ideal, but Win does say, on the genius code CDs, that you can kind of imagine him to be present and do the image-streaming to the imagined 'him' in the room.
Well, tried that too, but in order to imagine "him" in the room, wouldn't that require a sense of 'seeing' him there? To me, that only complicates things even more.
It's obvious (from the many books and articles I've read on the subject) that those who do visualize have little to no comprehension of how frustrating it is when you don't seem to be able to fit into the "visualizer" category. It's like telling a blind person that surely they must be able to see something!
I'd love to be able to use different hypnosis CD's to take off weight and become more successful, but no one seems to address things on CD's at least, in a way that the non-visual person can work with them. Anyone of them that asks me to "visualize yourself as you were when you were thin" or "see yourself as a successful person" is really asking a lot - first of all it's been way longer than I can remember consciously (and I don't have any pictures of that time, as they were all lost many years ago), and the only visuals I have of myself with the "eyes open" technique is of being over-weight. I've tried pasting my head on a thinner body, but it's still a fat head on a thin body. That's the "picture" of what is happening here.
Sorry to make this sound so bleak, but at this point in time, and for years past, it's what I've been stuck with. For a while I thought I might be the only one out there, so if it's anything of comfort, at least I know now that I'm not such an odd-ball after all.
Unis
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Joined: Dec 2006
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OP
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Quote:
@ Decision2change:
(using paraliminals while doing things?)
I think that it may have been other products that I was referring to. Or perhaps I was trying to use paraliminals while doing breakfast, etc. I'd not recommend it today. Unless you've got no time at all and wont do the paraliminals unless. And then, perhaps, it is even more important to just lay down for a spell... : D
Thanks Tore!
I have now picked up some new tapes and booklets from my friend and am going through them. I will have questions ... a bit later on.
Thanks again!!
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Joined: May 2005
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HI Unis
Happy New Year to you!
Even if you don' visualize with eyes closed, I believe that your unconsious mind still processes the information. The ability to visualise with open eyes is still there, so the circuits still exist. Perhaps you do not need to be consious of the visuualisation...
Back tot he positives--- can you work with what you do have? Perhaps self suggestion that your unconsious mind will process images at a different time...
As for hypnosis- lots of different useful trance states can occur with eyes open. If you visualise with eyes open and will not be distracted by environmental elements, why not go for it? Maybe a cheap eye mask like the ones from a travel store may help...Nohing to lose...
Besides, you will have the mask fro when you finaly get tot the west coast for cofee <grin>
vitaman
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Hi Unis,
marc:
but Win does say, on the genius code CDs, that you can kind of imagine him to be present and do the image-streaming to the imagined 'him' in the room.
Unis:
Well, tried that too, but in order to imagine "him" in the room, wouldn't that require a sense of 'seeing' him there?
marc's reply:
Well, I don't know about that. If you're sitting in a roomful of meditators or people chanting, say, and your eyes are shut, don't you have a sense of them there in the room? Do you have to keep opening your eyes and looking at them to prove to yourself that they really are present?
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marc:
Did you see my response to your post...
Unis:
Well, yes, and I had mentioned it in your thread last week over on the CRI df as well.
marc:
I thought that was someone called Gem. Or perhaps I missed a post by Unis - my browser does seem to be playing up a bit. And I shy away from that thread a bit, as you can probably imagine, though I really appreciate the replies. Many thanks for your post, anyway.
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Unis:
It appears that you get far more visually than I have since before my father bashed my head into the floor nearly 40 years ago. Just before that ... was the last time I had anything I could call "visualization on demand". I had a serious concussion then, but since they didn't routinely do MRI's back then, as they probably didn't have the technology, I'm thinking there might be some brain damage.
Marc:
Head/neck trauma leading to mental function loss. Have you ever had craniosacral therapy? A very good friend of mine had a session in which she had a flash of a time when as a little girl she had caught her chin on top of something as she jumped down from a step or a chair, and catching her chin had given her head a jolt backwards, an event she had completely forgotten about. I saw a demo of craniosacral where an audience member with some very severe stiffness and pain due to a long-ago car accident gained what seemed like an astonishing relief from a lot of her hassles from just this single demo session [in front of about 200 people...]. I know, it's yet another thing to try, but if the opportunity came up...
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I repeat something I posted on that other thread: when you go inside and look for images,make sure you're looking, and not just talking to yourself (eg about how you can't see anything) and listening to your replies, and NOT looking...
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I don't think I'm doing particularly well with the image streaming, but at least it offers a practical discipline to try, and I [think I] see the logic behind it, the logic of why it should improve communications between conscious and inner minds. Something else I sometimes do: outside of image streaming, I often see the colours purple and a kind of bright limey green colour when I meditate. When I image stream, I will sometimes look for these colours,invite them in, ask if they're there and very often they come, quicker than they would if I were meditating (I guess) and anyway, I'm not really meditating, yet still the colours come. And I do the image-steaming thing with it: "There's the purple in the lower half, oh now it's swapped over and there's green in the lower half of my visual field and the purple is kind of flowing up and to the right, oh, now the green is flowing upwards and to the left..." And so on. Placing attention on it helps conscious awareness pull it through the door from the inner mind into conscious awareness... And it gets stronger the more I do it.
Don't give up!
regards,
Marc
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