Forums IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ PhotoReading, Memory Optimizer Throwing in the towel

In the end I have to resort to Rapid Reading anyway in order to understand anything. My fastest PR speed of all time is 1500 wpm which isn't even a warm up for most speedreaders. Superreading and Dipping is essentially useless and leads to gathering tons of partial ideas or a basic summary at best. Nothing falls into place till I Rapid Read.

About 6 months ago someone here told me to fine tune my purposes and mind probe questions, trigger words and mind maps. That doubled the time i spent reading and cut my wpm in half. When I knocked all that stuff off and focused on increasing my rapid reading speed I actually started getting somewhere in my reading, but I wasn't doing the Photoreading, just speed reading.

I've been trying to get this to work for almost 2 years. I can recite the PR book by heart practically so please don't ask me how many "30 minute activation sessions" I used or how many "branches on my mind maps" I added during each activation session. I have no clue what's being said unless I read every word in order from start to finish.

Am I the only one here like that? I just have to read all the words or I'm lost.

"Superreading and Dipping is essentially useless and leads to gathering tons of partial ideas or a basic summary at best. Nothing falls into place till I Rapid Read."

A couple questions:
1) What kind of texts are you reading? For some texts, rapid reading is indeed the best solution, although if you get creative you can still substitute with SR+D.
2) How many passes are you doing with SR+D? If you feel you still don't have the gist of the text, you simply need more passes. This may seem slow at first, but with practice (after doing the PRing step, more on that later) your other than conscious mind and conscious mind will work together better, picking out more relevant and essential parts of the text.
3) How relaxed are you while PRing? You sound a little stressed the system isn't working, which is understandable, but if you bring that stress into the PR step, your other than conscious mind will be filling with, "This can't work, this doesn't work, I've been trying forever and can't get this to work" instead of filling with the material you're trying to absorb at a relaxed pace.

I hope you stick with it. Once you get it to work there's no going back. =)

-Ramon http://razor.ramon.com

Even if you only want to rapid read, forgetting about mind mapping, trigger words... Keep the statement of purpose, have a purpose for reading, ask yourself why you want to read the book, then still do the photoreading part. You'll probably find that rapid reading goes faster.

Also consider doing it in layers... really superread the whole book 2 or 3 times. If only to make what you read stick in the long term memory better. If you are reading for study this is what you'll want.

The idea of photoreading is to enable you to cover more ground for study. It isn't only reading speed that you want to improve it study skills. For many courses of study most people have to reread textbooks and manual repeatedly to understand them. If you're using regular reading methods you naturally take 3 times longer than a photoreader. What most people overlook is the time spent making notes, practicing the exercises and revision also take time, when you use photoreading related skills you also spend less time on these.

Learning isn't just reading the text it's gaining an understanding of what it's about and how you can use the information. Most people cannot do that just by reading the book once and without realising it they often reread the book 2 or 3 times. Once through then while writing out their assignments they often open the book again... taking ages to find the right page again... missing out on one of the key reason for photoreading the book.

Alex

Mark,

Call me for a free PhotoReading coaching session when you have 10-15 minutes to spare. 800-735-8273. Ext.211. We'll figure out how to get the system working for you. Have your little blue PhotoReading book handy.

When one does the 5 steps correctly, you'll immediately be able to get through and learn, comprehend, and retain all types of printed material 3 times faster than the time you'd have to spend with regular reading, and re-reading and re-reading.

Dana

I appreciate the assistance and yes I've done the "5 steps" over and over again on over 500 books now and yes I do uncover the "10% relevant information" and all that but when I go back and rapid read the whole text I gather all the information just as quickly in one pass as I can do in multiple passes without missing any small details that may be the missing link I need in order to understant the information. I can Sr and dip and nail the "10% relevant information" in a few minutes without doing anything else, who can't? If a book has a table of contents and/or a glossary you've got the "10%" at your finger tips. I can actually get the "10%" in less than 15 minutes per 100 pages but I want the other 90% too. For that I need to just read fast.

My problem is I want 100% and without it I don't feel as if I know the information well enough. I was just wondering if there was anyone else like me who's just flat out picky about how we read.

Mark,
I enjoy reading every word of some books. I even enjoy reading some sentences over and over again. It's like a thirst.

But, books that i am studying. Nope. I want the 20% (it's not 10%--the rule is 20% of the material covers 80% of the meaning) quickly so that i can make decisions about where i'm going next.

So, make a decision: If you want 100% of the info, then read every word. Remembering 100% of the material is another matter though. Do you actually recall right now, 100% of the material of the books you have read?

If, however, you want to gleen 20% of the material that carries 80% of the meaning, then PhR..activate...etc.

Call Dana it would do you some good to hear what he has to offer.

Anyone who has done 500 books and still doesn't get it has in fact gotten it and doesn't know it You present a very interesting scenerio to those of us who like a challenges.

MarkP4,

It seems you are doing all the steps correctly, except probably the most important one: what are your objectives and goals for reading the material.

You need to know what you want out of the material to activate the information you have photoread, and get what you want.

Is it impossible to believe that rapid reading 1 time through could beat Photoreadign and activating using multiple passes?

Is it hard to believe that getting "10%" out of a book just doesn't cut it?

I just don't see the point of putting the cart before the horse. I just want to know if there are some people here that have to resort to rapid reading pretty much every time they try to photoread something. From the sounds of it there isn't anyone here not unhappy with getting 10% so I guess I'm the freak.

Do I have 100% retention of everything I rapid read? Of course not but I sure can talk your ear off about what's in the book. After Photoreading I could probably meditate on it then answer t/f or multiple choice questions in the neighborhood of 70%. Which is better?

I can skitter a book and dig out 10% real quick. If that's all that I want. Old School Speedreading used to call that "scanning" or 'surveying."

Mark,

I'm sorry you're having a hard time with it. I asked before what kind of texts you are reading, which is important.

For example, many of the philosophy texts I read makes it heard to SR+D, because it's a dense text; logic papers are almost anti-PR, because there really isn't that much irrelevant text to begin with - logicians try to stay succinct as possible.

There are still exceptions like Descartes, where half the text is simply giving examples or reiterating previous points; here SR+D works well.

I find that the easiest books to SR+Dip are "Idiot's Guide to" books. I really like the series of books since they try to explain things in easier terms, but if you SR+Dip it, you can get done if much less time. I read a book in a similar format using SR+D and took in all the information from start to finish in less than 45 minutes; as a 200+ page book, it's not too bad.

"Do I have 100% retention of everything I rapid read? Of course not but I sure can talk your ear off about what's in the book. After Photoreading I could probably meditate on it then answer t/f or multiple choice questions in the neighborhood of 70%. Which is better?"

Mark, try a system that my friend and I devised. You do one pass of PRing, then a couple photoflip sessions, then just rapid read as possible without going back. Keep in mind you will do some SR+Dip sessions later as this will relax your "I missed a lot" feeling. Then just run a couple SR+Dip sections. If you are allocating your time correctly you should come out way ahead.

I studied Evelyn Woods Speedreading and PRing, so using each system separately on two similar books (same author same topic) the PRing was done faster and had better retention than a one-pass speedread.

-Ramon http://razor.ramon.com

I read mostly self help books and anything related to self improvement. I also try novels but I usually like to read them normally.

It's funny that you say to rapid read then sr/dip because that's what I'm resorting to now, I rapid read first then go back and skitter/dip or postview/dip to review what I most want to remember. That's why I asked the question in the first place about is there anyone else here that has to rapid read almost every book they photoread.

If I pick up a book in a bookstore I know that through the concept of "schema" (previous knowledge about a certain subject) I can turn the pages and just survey what the book is about and in less than 10 minutes come up with a certain feelings about it. NLP (which PR is said to incorporate) states that any sensory experience can set off a series of patterns of memory. In other words, the trigger words from the book trigger my memories, they trip my patterns off causing 1 or many states... "I have a hunch about what this book is about!"

Any NLP'rs, please correct me if I'm wrong.

From a scientific or business man stand point I've got to prove that I'm learning new information and not just taking a walk through memory lane via my patterns. PR/Sr/Dip/etc does give me hunches and feelings and 10% of the book in 1/3rd the time than if I just read a book normally. But it only gives me what I already know also, nothing new.

I Photoread a book on diabetes once what I cam out with was a series of things someone should and should not eat or do. But I already knew it, I reinforced what I already knew and I'm sure some people would be happy to feel like a know it all, but I don't, I wanted new information, I wanted what I didn't know. So I went back and rapid read the rest (90% remaining) of the material that did not trigger a memory, that I didn't previously know anything about so i could not craft a question or purpose about it beforehand and I found that that information was exactly what I needed.

Yes I've tried the open ended questions "what do I not know about that I really need to know" etc and the purposes "I'm Photoreading this book for the purpose of uncovering the specifics of ______ that I may not have thought before." My observation based on my experience is, If I pr, then postview and dip I can see things in the text that I didn't know I about and that I do want to know about and if I were to look at it as a whole it would be close to 10% of the information in the book. The other 90% I could get through rapidreading. my total photoreading time is going to be dependent on my fastest comprehension reading speed if I choose to do that step and go after more than "10%" so wouldn't it make sense to work at increasing that?

I do see the point in doing trigger words, mind maps and writing out purposes and questions if you are forced to sit in a class or meeting and you are using them to activate the material or think about it more. But that's a decision making thing, not reading and if you think about it, it sounds like "active incubation." To go through all that when you're clocking your wpm or are really pressed for time, it's so time consuming. I think that as someone gets faster at PR they stop doing steps that they think is unecessary and they also get faster at reading by not reading everything, not by actually reading or understanding faster.

Just as a small favor to me, in your spare time photoread then preview/dip and see if you can't get "10%" in about 15 minutes. Getting 10% in about an hour is not that good if you ask me.