Forums IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ Spring Forest Qigong to Visualize or go into Emptiness - that is the question

When one is doing the active excercise, master Lin says to visualize energy moving, but he also says to stay in emptiness. Which is it? :-)

I find myself fluctuating between visualizing and then going to emptiness. Back and forth. But sometimes it seems strained.
How do YOU do this?
thanks...........
RC

RC,
Emptiness to some is the place where there is truly "nothing" there. If there is nothing there, one's being is not there than how does one knows when to bring one's existence back to the time of being ?

I view emptiness as clearing out the mind, the obstruction of the surroundings.
For practicing SFQ, there is that place of time where I want to be, clearing out the daily worry and sometime just listening the music on the tape/CD while I practice and sometime just quiet and close my eyes.
That is the initial step. Then follow the instruction like visualize the qi breathing in through the skin and breathing the qi out of the skin. Visualize the energy movement as suggested. Some people do sense that. It depends on the individual.

When your practice progress you will find your own place of emptiness, specially when you are doing meditation.

[This message has been edited by Bluebird (edited September 20, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by Bluebird (edited September 20, 2004).]

Good question Rockchuck and great answer Bluebird. Just to add some more practical advice....

We often keep several things going in our mind at the same time. The modern term is multi-tasking but in fact our minds have always been incredible at thinking about many things at the same time. In general people can think about 4 to 7 things conciously at the same time. Subconciously all kinds of things are going on.

By doing the active exercises you are getting your brainpower to start filling up those 4 to 7 concious thoughtways with good positive visualizations. Feel the energy in your hands, breath in good clean energy and exhale negative energy, do reverse breathing, feel the front and back channel meeting in your lower dan tien, see a bright light in your lower dan tien and so forth. As your relax, your mind seems to slow down and ultimately you will have only 1 or 2 thoughtways goings and if successful you will move into the quietness and then into the emptiness where you can keep your mind clear and have no concious thoughts. This is where you really want to be so you can maximize energy flow and healing.

In all honesty it is not easy in the begining to reach the emptiness or stay there for very long. Our babbling mind just doesn't want to stay quiet. You have to be a detached observer and just watch the thoughts keep bubbling up and then gently release them like baloons floating off into the sky and clear your mind again. Try not to move or shift your physical body as this seems to get the mental chatter going again. Be patient with yourself and know that it takes time to get to and stay in the emptiness. The more time you can spend there, then the more powerful your progress will be. In fact instead of thinking as we do in our slow physical world, in the emptiness you will be experiencing the world at the speed of light and great flashes of insight and experiences will be yours.

Agent B

Hi Rockchuk,
Look at the visualization of energy moving, as a means to reaching emptiness. You are focusing your mind on something, giving 'it', something productive to do that benefits you. Over an ongoing practice, this focus on moving energy, is somewhat the same as a mantra. It becomes a singular repeating point of focus. In longer or deeper focus, you can lapse in and out of self conscious focus, and slip into deeper states, perhaps emptiness, or at a minimum, moving closer to that. Regardless, you are aware of the shift, as you become self conscious again, and rejoin your focus and self awareness. One is the means to reach the other, as opposed to looking at it as a choice between two different things. You can be relaxing, innertubing down the river, doze off, with no awareness of the river, and come to again, finding that you continue to flow with the current and direction of the water.
love,
gallen

Well I held back until the big guns piped in.

Now for juniors two cents. I agree with everything that has been said, except with the "it's hard". Sorry AgentB, but I'm reviewing the material ( I seem to always review some part or other) and Master Lin brought up this issue of difficult. The Western mind thinks do X, Y and get Z. If it doesn't happen the first time then it's Hard. The idea that it is hard, is counter productive.

Rockchuk, all those here will agree that you just let go and focus on the meditation as instructed and you will get there.

Master Lin has indicated that there are different levels of the emptiness (understand this as getting closer to the emptiness (understand that as the universal truth / energy / love)).

Like most things in SFQ, I don't seem to recognize my progress until after the fact. For instance I would do the small universe and then come out of a black quiet no-thought place. When this happened I was more concerned with loosing my place in the small universe circuit, itstead of realizing I had come out of the emptiness.

Then when I came out of this no thought place (quiet) I would sometimes experience a totally white light experience. I have no recollection of the black or white, only that coming out or them, or is it through them? I have no idea how long I've been there.

The point is I just relax and focus on the meditations and I go there without consciously seeking it. It didn't happen the first few (dozen) times I did the meditations. However, when I became comfortable with my technique and could get out of my consciously controlling and monitoring the meditation, that's when it happened.

Master Lin discusses the Emptiness in differing levels as you progress through the practice. In his book born a healer, he talks about some students going into the emptiness and experiencing themselves on a beach or flying. It's a personal thing.

In later material he talks about the different types / forms / levels of the emptiness. He also talks about going into the emptiness for purification and for education. He seems to consider these as two different meditations. In both you enter the emptiness (no level stated). In purification you allow all thoughts to pass away. In the education, you enter the meditation with a question or request and then you notice the thoughts that come to you while in the emptiness.

As a note, sleep is a form of meditation and just last night I used it as an education meditation. I asked for guidance and awoke with my guidance, in the middle of the night.

This idea of asking questions before sleep is quite common, but I only just put those two pieces of information together. Namely sleep is meditation and getting answers while sleeping. So I now feel even better that I can do SFQ while sleeping.

You are perfection.
Iam2 junior

Aloha All,

When one truly goes into the emptiness, pursuit of the meditation or active exercise is no long is there.

As has been mentioned above, the emptiness is not just quieting your mind and thinking about no thing. Starting out, many think that a quieting of sorts is the emptiness. While it is a good stepping stone as Agent B points out with the active exercises, visualizations and sounds helping to take that initial step.

When at some point in one's days, weeks, months, years of practice, they go into the emptiness, it all becomes that and not that, and there is no either/or. It's simply... amazing.

Much love, Shawn

Thank you to all!! I so very much appreciate your wise and caring answers. They are all keepers and I will want to comment more on them as I go over them again.

But a couple questions still come to mind right now.

I think I got in the answers that visualizing is a means to an end, a stepping stone to the best state, which is emptiness. Is this correct?

Therefore, the energy moving in the active excercise, is not dependent on using visualization to move it? Is this correct?
If I go into emptiness, is the Qi still moving optimally?
(note: I am using SFQ mainly at this point for physical healing of old stubborn issues)

I am somewhat familair with the emptiness because of previous meditation practices, and I personally would prefer to be there. But again, I am wanting optimal physical healing at this point, thus the questions about the visualizations.

Thanks again you guys....what a great forum!

TO CLARIFY A BIT MORE:

I think my answers have already been given by your replies, I don't want you to think I'm not paying attention to what you're saying.
I just am still not clear in my mind what the BEST state is for physical healing, visualization or emptiness or a super combo.

Thanks for your patience on this.........
RC

Hi Rockchuk,
I am afraid we have you chasing your tail, and I am starting, to look at mine!
Do the exercises as given. Do the visualizations given. Simple. End of story. This is where you should focus. I think the 'super combo' is on sale this week at Burger King.
love,
gallen

LOL

Master Lin's best advice for someone starting SFQ is to do the level one material, just as the tail chasing gallen has suggested.

If you progress quickly because of your past experience then that is good. It is your choice to follow Master Lin or not, but most here will say that they have choosen to follow his instruction and progress along his charted path.

You are perfection.
Iam2