Forums IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ Beyond Human What happens after Holosync?

Thanks Garic. I am well aware of the lower carrier frequency claim, I don't know if Nick is talking about this or other differences that I am not aware of.

If lower carrier frequencies made Holosync more efficient, all one has to do is to encode his own cds with such frequencies using brainwave generator software. Of all the companies in brainwave entrainment business, Holosync seems to be the only one make the claim that lower carrier frequencies are superior, for heaven's sake let's assume that claim is true, why can't people just make their own cds using these lower carrier frequencies, without paying the high price to Holosync? Why there are those still insist after listening to products from all major producers of brainwave entrainment products and from BWGEN encoded cds, that Holosync is more special? and why NONE of the Holysync clients who completed the advanced level of listening come out testify that they indeed have achieved the promised results? The only one person who did come out, (SuzyQ?), was not all that positive about Holosync to say the least.

It also bothers me that all of you regular credible contributors seem to all defending Holosync, some with initial negative view but very quickly (in two weeks of listening according to the psot) changed their mind, Alex, who is normally neutral and objective, come to Bill's defense as well, this all coincides with the new lease of LSC CD'S that use the Holosync encoding, I wonder if there is pressure from the top to promote the Holosync now, just a thought, a reasonable thought.

Peace and love to all.

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Originally posted by Fear Not!:
Thanks Garic. I am well aware of the lower carrier frequency claim, I don't know if Nick is talking about this or other differences that I am not aware of.

If lower carrier frequencies made Holosync more efficient, all one has to do is to encode his own cds with such frequencies using brainwave generator software. Of all the companies in brainwave entrainment business, Holosync seems to be the only one make the claim that lower carrier frequencies are superior, for heaven's sake let's assume that claim is true, why can't people just make their own cds using these lower carrier frequencies, without paying the high price to Holosync? .

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Thats why I've been giving out the "recipe" for holosync on this and other forums for the last three years. Because the low-carrier frequncy technology has been effective in my own case and I want to give others the opportunity to try it without any outlay of cash.

I have no interest whatsoever in either defending or promoting Bill Harris as a person, or Centerpointe as a company. My only interest as far as holosync goes, is in promoting a discussion between people who are sincerely interested in determining the effectiveness of the low carrier frequency technology and its potential usefulness in their own lives.
Others on this forum seem extremely interested and even addicted to these more "political" kinds of discussions however.

[This message has been edited by garics (edited February 02, 2005).]

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Originally posted by Fear Not!:
Thanks Garic. I am well aware of the lower carrier frequency claim,

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I knew you were aware of it, I was simply re-stating it at the beginning in order to make the point.

I can assure you that I am under no pressure to advocate or not advocate holosync.

I am merely stating the opinions based on my experience.

I think you have some good points to make, Fear Not, but please, do not insult me by implication. I am not mindless or brainwashed. I am in general a quite skeptical person.

I have just come to different conclusions than you.

I don't know if you've mentioned it, but have you tried holosync and compared it to other products yourself?

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Originally posted by Fear Not!:

It also bothers me that all of you regular credible contributors seem to all defending Holosync, some with initial negative view but very quickly (in two weeks of listening according to the psot) changed their mind, Alex, who is normally neutral and objective, come to Bill's defense as well, this all coincides with the new lease of LSC CD'S that use the Holosync encoding, I wonder if there is pressure from the top to promote the Holosync now, just a thought, a reasonable thought.

Peace and love to all.

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I have always been a fan of entrainment technology. I was saying. While there is no "objective proof" that entrainment works neither was there any objective proof that car will work as transportation over 120 years ago when it was invented. It was purely "subjective" experience back then. It's not until there are enough people using it that we start to collect objective data.

As to whether Centerpointe is still the best. I don't know.

Paul has often used his Paraliminals with a light and sound device. He knew it makes the experience more interesting. In response to the many requests. Adding an entrainment sound track to the Paraliminals seemed a logical approach while keeping the cost down.

Alex

Thanks Alex. My reference of "supporting data" was referring to Bill Harris' outragious claims of the benifits of Holosync CD's, not about the potential benifits of brainwave entrainment, and I am in agreement with you on your view that the data about the health benifits (or not) on entrainment will come later, but I also maintain that Bill Harris' claims about the unproven effects on his commercial products are irresponsible and should be considered a FRAUD!

Babayada, yes, I have used Hemi-sync, Holosync, Insights, and my homemade GWGEN cds. I like the calming effects of Holosync's rian chimes, and I have been meditating for many years. The natural sound of rain by itself can be calming, personally I have not experienced any "meditation like state" induced by brainwave entrainment products, except for the calmness, which I also get from listening to pure natural sounds cds without brainwave entrainment encoding. Beliefs has a lot to do with the outcome, I gather those who believe in Bill Harris' claims are naturally more likely to create the perceived outcomes they expect. You know sometimes you see people being con-ed and manipulated by sharks you just feel sorry for them and want to do something to help, that's all it is. peace!

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Originally posted by Fear Not!:
...but I also maintain that Bill Harris' claims about the unproven effects on his commercial products are irresponsible and should be considered a FRAUD!

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Or, maybe it just didn't work as well for you? I prefer my regular meditation, but I have heard many say how they love the effects of HS.

I don't think it's fair to call someone a fraud when, in fact, it might be just your own reaction to the product. I think these things are more personal.

Since we are all unique, one size doesn't necessarily fit all. It didn't do much for me, yet one of my friends raves on about it. Obviously, it worked very well for her. She feels she got her money's worth, and more. My disks collect dust. Even so--that doesn't mean they won't work for me some time in the future, so for now, I hold onto them. Eventually, I might give them to another friend, who knows?

However, I do not feel as though I've been "taken" or defrauded. I just feel that I found a product that didn't work for me, like that ghastly yellow dress I thought was the cats meow last year. It was the real deal, but just not the "deal" for me.

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Originally posted by Jeanne:

I don't think it's fair to call someone a fraud when, in fact, it might be just your own reaction to the product. I think these things are more personal.

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Thanks for your reply. Sorry for my bad English and typos, I am not an English speaker, Whether an advertisement is fraud or not has nothing to do with my personal experience with the product, it has nothing to do with your personal experience either, it's all about the fairness, objectivity, and the law. Here are some excerts from FTC ruling regarding a similar claims for brainwave entrainment cds and related devices by a compny (Zygon) in 1996:

....is defined in the Federal Trade Commission Act, do forthwith cease and desist from representing, in any manner, directly or by implication, that the use of such product or program can or will have any effect on the user's:

A. Health or bodily structure or function, including but not limited to sleep; weight, bodyfat content, or body shape or tone; immune system; eyesight or night vision; stress; or jet lag; or

B. Smoking behavior,

unless at the time of making such representation, respondents possess and rely upon competent and reliable scientific evidence that substantiates such representation. For purposes of this Order, "competent and reliable scientific evidence" shall mean tests, analyses, research, studies, or other evidence based on the expertise of professionals in the relevant area, that has been conducted and evaluated in an objective manner by persons qualified to do so, using procedures generally accepted in the profession to yield accurate and reliable results.

...is defined in the Federal Trade Commission Act, do forthwith cease and desist from representing, in any manner, directly or by implication, that the use of such product or program can or will have any effect on the user's cognitive or mental functions or skills, including but not limited to reading, vocabulary, learning, foreign language, verbal or math skills; intelligence or I.Q. or that of the user's children; attention or concentration levels; or memory, unless at the time of making such representation, respondents possess and rely upon competent and reliable evidence, which when appropriate must be competent and reliable scientific evidence, that substantiates such representation.

...is defined in the Federal Trade Commission Act, do forthwith cease and desist from making any representation, in any manner, directly or by implication:

A. Regarding the performance, benefits, efficacy, or safety of any food, drug, or device, as those terms are defined in Section 15 of the Federal Trade Commission Act, 15 U.S.C. § 55, or dietary supplement, unless, at the time of making such representation, respondents possess and rely upon competent and reliable scientific evidence that substantiates such representation.

B. Regarding the performance, benefits, efficacy or safety of any product or service (other than a product or service covered under Part III.A herein), unless, at the time of making such representation, respondents possess and rely upon competent and reliable evidence, which when appropriate must be competent and reliable scientific evidence, that substantiates such representation.

[This message has been edited by Fear Not! (edited February 03, 2005).]

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Originally posted by Fear Not!:
[QUOTE]
Thanks for your reply. Sorry for my bad English and typos, I am not an English speaker, [b]Whether an advertisement is fraud or not has nothing to do with my personal experience with the product, it has nothing to do with your personal experience either, it's all about the fairness, objectivity, and the law.

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I thought your language was just fine, but I'm not sure your conclusions about CP are valid.

Just the other day I bought a music CD by a well known artist. On the CD case and in magazine ads for this CD, I was promised that I'd be "swept off my feet" by the beauty of this music. In point of fact, it reminded me so much of "Muzak" and dentists' offices, that it gave me a headache.

I would not accuse the artist or his publicists of "fraud." Actually, many people would agree with them--and they will buy more of his CDs. Because they hear something I do not, their spirits will soar (as the CD cover said) and these CDs will do a lot of good in the world.

I see the CP products in the same way. For my friend, they were as advertised. For me, well, they sounded nice, but I prefer regular meditation. Just my taste--and just my choice. I would hope the feds stay out of this one, since these CDs obviously do help many people.

You do believe in allowing people to make up their own minds and make their own choices, right?

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You do believe in allowing people to make up their own minds and make their own choices, right? [/B]

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Absolutely! But I also believe in fairness and business ethics. Don't promise any benifits and effects that are unproven, instead, disclose to the public that the claims are only speculations, personal opinions and personal believes, not the facts or truth. One-sided claims are not about "allowing people to make up their own minds and make their own choices", right?

[This message has been edited by Fear Not! (edited February 03, 2005).]