Forums IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ Beyond Human To Holosync or not to Holosync

I have been using Holosync since August 2004 on virtually a daily basis. I began with Awakening Prologue and have begun Awakening Level Two. My reason for writing on this Forum is just to say that I feel I have reached a cross roads as it where. You see after 18 months of using Holosync as instructed I can look back now and say that nothing has happened and that nothing has changed. So where does that leave me? To be honest I guess I am feeling a little sorry for myself that I feel no changes have taken place at all when I have read so many testimonials from other users who say their world is changing beyond their wildest dreams. Me? I still feel the same old Steve, no more no less. And so the cross roads I feel is that I am now having to seriously consider whether to carry on with Holosync. An hour a day is a lot of time to spend on something that doesn't work for me.

In one sense though this does not surprise me as I have always considered that what works for one person is not a guarantee that it will work for someone else regardless of whether we are talking about religion, philosophy, NLP, primal therapy or whatever. So yes in one sense it is no surprise to me that Holosync has not worked for me.

Yes I know some might think Holosync does work per se and that therefore I must be doing something wrong, or that maybe I am not truly willing to change and just don't realise it etc etc etc. This line of argument of course gives credence to the idea I have mentioned in the preceding paragraph.

So for the time being I am in a flux. To Holosync or not to Holosync. Truth is I have almost made up my mind.

Well in my book you're to be commended for having the patience and determination to continue holosync for as long as you have....I don't think I would have continued with holosync for more than a couple of months if I hadn't been noticing any benefits from it.

Just one question Stevie: what do you actually experience while you're listening to the tracks? Do you just feel bored, do you fall asleep, or do you do some kind of specific meditative technique, etc.
Also you've tested your headphones for proper stereo separation right?

Try the Insight Meditation Correspondence Course maybe?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1564554341/sr=1-1/qid=1138841267/ref=sr_1_1/104-7190861-0468716?%5Fencoding=UTF8

Well, I am a long term meditator, and an ex holosync user ( I like the product but not for the big bucks....)

I guess I have two thoughts to offer, that may or may not be useful for you.

First, watching my children grow up, I do not realy notice the small incremental changes day to day. But when I see my god-daughter or nephew every few weeks, I say WOW!
...Those small incremental changes add up when you are not noticing them!

The other thing is, as you might guess from my nickname, I like vitamins and health foods. (junk food too, a bit) I take my vitamins daily NOT to see an immediate efect, but for long term benefits. Like changing the oil in your car regularly, it wears down a little more slowly. Meditation is like that, reducing cortisol and the other effects of stress, slowly has a cummulative effect over time.

I still use my holosync from time to time, but also use my other recordings, do other forms of meditaion, qigong, etc. All part of good self care. I would probably still use the products if they did not want so much money for them, and if they werent so agressive int heir marketting push.

vitaman

Garics

Thanks for getting in touch. I would answer your questions as follows

When using Holosync I invariably fall asleep. I have tried staying awake but found it a futile exercise. Part of the problem is due to the fact that I get up at 5am in the morning and start work at 7am. I usually arrive home about 6pm and needless to say a session on Holosync soon sends me into a deep sleep. On the rare occasions when I do remain awake I find myself getting bored and restless.

Again, on the occasions I have tried a meditative technique; partly in an attempt to remain 'awake and focused' on the mediation I find that I fall asleep quite quickly.

I have to be honest and say I have not tested my headphones as you suggest.

Please get back to me Garics and let me know what you think of the comments I have made.

Kind regards
Stevie

Vita-man

Thanks for your comments. I appreciate what you are saying. I guess my concern is that looking back to August 2004 when I began Holosync and comparing that Steve with the Steve of today I do not even see any small changes that might be adding up. I am sure I have read somewhere in this forum that maybe it is best not to get too hung up on the results of Holosync but just to do the meditation and then one day, almost as you say, a 'WOW' experience of some description kicks in. I guess I am just getting a little frustrated that I feel I have experienced no real benefits. Even a small WOW might have inspired me to continue. At the end of the day we are only human and generally a little encouragement or tangible incentive can help us travel that extra mile so to speak. But when the road seems empty it can take a lot of faith or whatever to keep on going.

Regards
Stevie

I am almost ready for level 4. I am an Inner Circle Member. When I listen I just visualise my self already having what I want and I usually get it, usually almost instantly. Not sure if this is due to Holosync or not but perhaps Holosync helps me get to the right level level of mind to help manifest things more quickly.

Can I ask how long it took you to get to that point? I did Holosync for over a year and a half and it just didnt seem like I was going anywhere.

Stevie,

I took me up to level AL 4 before I realized positive changes. It kept going because I realized that hs was working for me. The proof of this were the different overwhelm symptoms.

I think the symptoms you have mentioned after a hs meditation are overwhelm symptoms too.

If I were you I would not buy another level
but continue to listen to your current level until you don't fall asleep of feel drowsy afterwards.

I started Purification 4 a few weeks ago this means I am now for 6 and a half year on the program and enjoy it.

Cheers,

I first experienced holo-sync from the Euphoria cd's. I woke up after listening several nights each to the cd's and found myself to be someone I recognized. what a shock. I bought the Awakening Prologue and it has worked wonders. I plan to go on to level 2 as soon as I can. I would like to suggest that the results can be very subtle and that unless one is very aware of what is actually going on in one's mind most of the time, a change can be missed in the short term. Events blend together so smoothly that it doesn't seem to change at all. However, the holosync stuff works even when one is sleeping. Perhaps you are working on areas where you most need it, yet, aren't aware that you need it. The dreaming self may be utilizing the process to make your experience seem seamless to you and you would not notice any change at all. I would like to suggest that you might try going back to the Awakening for a few days or evenings to see if you can still stay asleep through it, then return to your normal level. Also, you might look to see if your health may have improved without you noticing it. Worth a try...no?

You definitely do not want to go to sleep during meditation. The whole purpose of meditation is bringing awareness to levels where it did not exist before.

If you have trouble with your hours, then you can turn any daily activity into a meditational activity. Just bring full awareness to it. Relax and be as fully aware as you can be, allowing yourself to witness what you are doing.

You can certainly witness the activity of the mind and body in this way, and I have no doubt it will be more beneficial than falling asleep to holosync.

quote:

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Originally posted by garics:
Well in my book you're to be commended for having the patience and determination to continue holosync for as long as you have....I don't think I would have continued with holosync for more than a couple of months if I hadn't been noticing any benefits from it.

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Garics and all--wow, this comment served as a little nudge for me. Although this topic is about Holosync, I've been working with another modality for a few months that has shown NO positive results at all. In fact, things keep going all wrong: a dvd stopped working, a replacement didn't even start working (although all my other dvds do fine), and so on.

I doggedly stuck with it as best I could--and then I read this post a few days ago. It snapped me back into sanity. I've dropped the practice of that particular modality, and it's as though the entire universe has opened up--a different (but not new, I'd used this before) practice made all the difference.

Back to Holosync, it just might be that like everything else, one size does not fit all--some folks might have better results using another technique. For instance, many of the QiGong meditations can do some very good work, and often very quickly. But there are others--Insight Meditation, Transcendental Meditation, etc., the list is very long.

In my case--your mileage may vary--I think it was a matter of my higer self struggling to get my attention, to let me know I was on the wrong path, that another was far better.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Frodo02:
[B]Stevie,

"I think the symptoms you have mentioned after a hs meditation are overwhelm symptoms too.
Frodo"

Thanks for replying. I find it interesting that you think I may be showing symptoms of overwhelm. When I began hs back in August 2004 I noticed that I also began experiencing sleep paralysis events. These events became quite frequent and at there peak I was experiencing them 6 or 7 times a week, sometimes more than once a night. I believe once a week is considered extreme! They were occasionally accompanied by full blown lucid dreams as well. None of these experiences concerned me too much as I was fully aware of what was happening. By and large the events have all but stopped and I guess I have experienced only a couple in the last eight months. Whether this was a result of hs I am not sure.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by babayada:
[B]"You definitely do not want to go to sleep during meditation. The whole purpose of meditation is bringing awareness to levels where it did not exist before."

Babayada

Short of standing up while using hs I just cannot seem to remain awake. I guess if all I am getting out of hs is a decent sleep it might be worth considering it a waste of time and money on my part. I note the literature does say hs works even when you are asleep. As I say I have some thinking to do as to whether I continue with hs.

Regards
Stevie

Stevie, Jeanne
O Sensei, the founder of Aikido, used to say

"There are many paths to the top of Mount Fuji....But there is only one Mount Fuji."

Maybe a different path would better suit you, or maybe the hardships of this particular path are what you need...Only your self could decide...follow your intuition.

See you at the summit!

vitaman

What about time out.? 3, 6, or 12 month break.

To see where the shifts take you? A return after a sabbatical might just yield some visible results. So perhaps rather than decide Holosync or not. Decide how long a break you want to take.

Alex

If one were to take a break from Holosync, would it be best to start from where you left off, or better to back-track a bit? I think I might try that.

Again, I strongly encourage investigating a different technique.

Learn more about meditation, try something new, and compare your experiences.
http://here-and-now.org/VSI/Articles/TheoryMed/theoryHow.htm

I have thought about trying Holosync, but I often hesitate and decide not to buy it. I have been listening to a hemi-sync cd from the Monroe Institute. I really enjoy it and I do feel alot calmer. Has anyone had results from other programs that they would like to share?

quote:

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Originally posted by chrisp:
If one were to take a break from Holosync, would it be best to start from where you left off, or better to back-track a bit? I think I might try that.

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Continue from where you left off. If you had to start over again it would be little better than an addiction. I don't think Holosync is something that is only a temporary effect and only available as long as you use it. Using it is supposed to aid your growth. It is possible that the level you quit at is too strong for you when you resume. Then I would consider stepping down for a time.

Alex

[ Has anyone had results from other programs that they would like to share?]

Since you asked...

I tried Holosync last year and although I thought it was very cool it wasn't what I need.

I think some people DO need it and some don't. I personally know people who would benefit greatly from it but some of us are ready for something "higher."

My personal opinion is that going into different brain wave patterns is great for those who have never done it. For me it didn't lead to any personal change. If going into deeper and deeper brainwave patterns lead to personal change then every night when we fall asleep we would be changing ourselves because we're going into those brainwave patterns automatically every night for free. What bothered me most about Holosync is once you bought Awakening Prologue you were bombarded with information selling you on the next level of the program. They really do back up their program with more science than I've ever seen in my life. But, like the low carb diet (which has more science behind it than any other diet), it just ain't for me.

I meditate using the www.higherbalance.com Foundation program. It's 25 minutes a day, no levels to buy. You don't "go deeper" into brain waves, you instead recharge your astral body to awaken your sixth sense.

Holosync deals with the brain and organism. Higher balance deals with the astral body, your energy body. Different strokes for different folks. There is no right or wrong, there is what you like and what you don't like.

For what it's worth, since Holosync and HigherBalance both have money back guarantees- try them both and return the one you don't like.

[This message has been edited by Coldrayne (edited February 09, 2006).]

I'm not sure that I really need it either and I am nearly ready to start level four. My only reason for using it is because I want to improve my mental abilities, creativity and problem solving skills and to increase my focus, concentration and learning, reduce sleep time and maybe get some benefit from the affirmations.

Anyway I have a few things like Spring Forest Qigong, Genius Code , Manifesting your Hearts Desire, Invisible Path to Success, Soon the Feng Shui course and a few things really outside the square and they are all oustandingly excellent but my favorite for it's pure power and simplicity (Chunyi Lin says the most simple things are the most powerful) and the results I have got the quickest by implementing the principles would have to be from Infinite Possibilities - The art of Living your Dreams.

If you are trying to overcome things that bother you which I think is what Holosync is mainly suppossed to be for then I would suggest Spring Forest Qigong and Diamond Feng Shui as from these you would also get many other benefits to numerous to mention.

I've been using Holosync for almost a year. Am I a different person? no. Do others around me notice changes? No. So why do I use it? Because I'm the same person, only better. I sleep better. I think more cogently. Solutions to problems come faster. I don't freak or panic when hit with sudden solve-them-RIGHT-NOW problems. I visualize easier, thus manifesting things better. My intuition speaks more clearly to my conscious mind.

I'm still a brass-plated, marshmallow-cored, grouchy, gentle wife-friend-and-cat-lover, but I'm much more "together." Holosync is helping my mind integrate itself, conscious to other-than-conscious, self to universe, heart mind and soul together. Different self? no. Changed self? Oh very much yes.

I am the same as you Stevie - I too have difficulty staying awake for the entire hour. Truth be told is that I love how it sends me to sleep.

If you really can't feel any difference why would you keep going? You do what works for you not what others say you should do.

I have just ordered the Awakening Level 2 and if I feel uncomfortable or if it doesn't seem to be doing much I will abandon HS or at least have a few years break.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tranquilwaters:
[B]I am the same as you Stevie - I too have difficulty staying awake for the entire hour. Truth be told is that I love how it sends me to sleep.

If you really can't feel any difference why would you keep going? You do what works for you not what others say you should do.

Tranquilwaters

Thanks for the reply. Yes I do enjoy the sleep too but I guess I expected more than that from HS.

Why do I keep going? Fair Question. To be honest I guess I wanted to give it my best shot and I felt giving it about a year or so was only fair. At the time I did HS I also thought I was doing what I wanted to and not what others where telling me to do. But I do take your point.

For the record I can add that I have given up HS at this moment in my life. I also suspect that I will not go back to it.

John Lennon had it right for me. Doesn't matter what I do, whatever it is life is still happening. Life is what happens when I am busy making other plans yet it is that "life" I never want to lose sight of.

Regards to you
Stevie

Yeah, I am having a few weeks break because the physical sensations caused by overwhelm are wearing me down. I haven't used the CD for three days and I feel better. For now I will just listen to the Floating or Gamma Compassion CD. There's a lot of changes about to happen in my work area so it will be better to get through that period without any extra discomfort caused by HS.

Its now what happens to us that matters, its how we choose to interpret and deal with it that makes or breaks us. Wise words... but sometimes we forget to use this wisdom! Well... I do. At least I've learned that when ****ty stuff is happening that "This moment too, will pass" and everything will feel better soon and no, I won't die after all. :-)

More power to you Stevie for being so open minded and willing to try new things. We're all a bit different and its different strokes for different folks.

quote:

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Originally posted by Tranquilwaters:

More power to you Stevie for being so open minded and willing to try new things. We're all a bit different and its different strokes for different folks.[/B]

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Tranquilwaters

That was kind of you to say that. And I have always believed we all have similarities and differences, and as you say it is a case of different strokes for different folks.

Can I ask you what kind of feelings you experienced that you would attribute to overwhelm caused by Holosync. Also how do you feel straighjt after a session with Holosync.

Regards
Stevie

I just got my holosync and i'm not quite sure what i'm supposed to use...

I have the Quietude, Oasis and Immersion CD's and then theres the Dive ...

Which one am i supposed to use daily?

Hello Golden_Era:

And welcome to the forums. If you ordered from Centerpointe, you should have received several pages of instructions, as well as a booklet explaining the process. However, to save time for you, these are the main instructions:

• Listen using Stereo ear-phones - the binaural beat tech will do nothing for you just playing on speakers.
  
• The CD (or tape) to start with is The Dive. You use The Dive ONLY for the first 14 days of using Holosync.
  
• After the 14 days you continue with the Immersion CD (or tape) directly following The Dive (no break between), so that you are meditating for one full hour.
  
• Use Quietude for times when you are working on something and want to help focus your creative mind.
  
• Use Oasis as a way to awaken your creativity.
  
• Until you get your bearings with Holosync, and after you've listened to the Dive only for 2 weeks, do not do more than the one hour of Holosync (Dive plus Immersion) per day, as you could push yourself too hard and end up with overwhelm.
  
• Most people do not experience major amounts of overwhelm if they listen to their bodies and their emotions, and follow instructions.
  
• Setting aside a specific time each day is a good way to establish the "habit" of meditating, and while some people say you benefit just as much from lying down, my own experience has shown a much greater benefit by sitting up, well supported back, as the instructions provide.
  

You should use the Awakening Prologue CD for a minimum of 4 to 6 months before moving on to the next level, and many people use it for much longer.

If you're getting your CD's from Centerpointe, don't be pushed into purchasing the Inner Circle by their advertising (large money commitment) until you're absolutely sure you want to go the whole route with the program - you will have at least two or three opportunities to do that later on. Don't be put off by the amount of advertising you get either, because sometimes they come up with some neat things - I actually found Learning Strategies through them, as well as The Sedona Method - both have been wonderful as additional self-growth and personal management tools to add to what Holosync is doing for you.

Cheers!
Unis

[This message has been edited by Unis (edited March 19, 2006).]

Thanks so much

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Unis:
[B]Hello Golden_Era:

While some people say you benefit just as much from lying down, my own experience has shown a much greater benefit by sitting up, well supported back, as the instructions provide.

Unis

Can you expand on this. What difference did you experience? I ask because I was always a "lie-down" meditator and have wondered whether sitting up would have been better for me.

Regards
Stevie

Stevie:

The more time I have spent listening to binaurals, the more I have noticed that posture indeed does make a big difference in the outcome, regardless of the type of product you are using (i.e. holosync vs. a concentration tape or whatever.)

It is ideal to assume a traditional meditative posture while listening to binaurals, i.e. on a comfortable mat or carpet, with a firm pillow supporting your lower back. Spine straight, and head tilted slightly forward.

(Technically, the spine is not perfectly straight; as I said, see a book or a course for exactly how the posture is supposed to be. But the spine stays relatively straight compared to the way most people are accustomed to sitting.)

The reason is that this posture allows the energy between different centers in your anatomy to flow with the least amount of obstruction, which is a great aid to any sort of "processing" or releasing work. If you practice listening to binaurals in this way for a while you will begin to feel this.

One of those "learn to meditate" kits might be advisable for the specifics.
Most of what you will be doing in the first few weeks of any "learn to meditate" course is simply get comfortable with sitting in the proper position for thirty minutes or so; until then all the "breath counting" or witnessing or whatever is merely "gold to stop the flow of a child's tears." (i.e., window dressing)

I do think, however, that using a program like holosync can be a good set of training wheels, and can make it easier to progress through the intial stages and the interupting thoughts and uncomfortable sensations that get in the way.

The better your diet and your overall state of health, the more quickly you will be able to master the basics.

I have learned it from a variety of sources and it is king of an intuitive thing. After a few moments of sitting like this I usually start to feel grounded in my hara, or lower dan-tien as Chunyi-Lin would say.
Then it seems to expand and fill my lower body almost completely.

After a few minutes the posture becomes effortless and natural, and it is easy to be perfectly upright and totally relaxed. I can start to feel my whole frontal line as a column of circulating energy... I feel grounded and anchored to the earth and at the same time connected to a point infinitely above my head. From there the meditation becomes a process of comfortably maintaining the posture while allowing mind to clear and remain clear. There are sensations of releasing obstructions along my frontal line, while being anchored in the point below the navel.
...When I am really "into it", it is like I am not there, although I am at the same time, completely aware, even more aware than usual, of the present moment and of every sensation that arises.

Doing some yoga or SFQ concurrently with a medtitative practice is a good idea, as it stregthens your body and teaches you how to intuitively recognize and maintain good posture.

You want to get to the point where you can hold your spine straight, while in a relaxed position for at least 30 minutes to an hour. It may seem like kind of a chore at first but it is a very good discipline to learn for your stress level and for your health.

Once you do this in conjunction with binaural proigrams like holosync I think you might notice a big difference.

If you are interested in pursuing this further, I would recommend a book or a course. There are a lot of books out there that will teach you how to use a mirror to establish the correct sitting posture. Spring Forest Qigong is always a useful complement for me as well.

Cheers

Garic

[This message has been edited by garics (edited March 20, 2006).]

quote:

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Can you expand on this. What difference did you experience? I ask because I was always a "lie-down" meditator and have wondered whether sitting up would have been better for me.

Regards
Stevie

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I believe the major difference for me is energy flow, and probably for the same reasons that when using the SFQ meditations it's better to do so sitting up.

When I started HS, I thought I'd never be able to sit up for the full hour because of my back. But I just didn't seem to be sensing anything, so decided to try what Centerpointe had suggested - sit up!

Well, I found a way to support my back, rolled up a comfortable towel to place between the back of my neck and the chair (for support, and also to hold the ear-phones close and stable to my head), and although I'm not completely vertical, my body is resting nicely at about an 80 degree angle in my lazy-boy chair. I also take advantage of the hour to put up my feet, which tend to swell during the day. I get major amounts of energy channeling up through my body, from the base of my spine and into my head, particularly at the brow and crown chakras, and I definitely have a sense of things happening all along the other chakras.

For one thing, when sitting up, you are much less likely to fall asleep (unless that is your intention). I like to use several different meditation techniques along with the HS, which I believe also enhances what HS does, and the overall experience of it. I use the more (inward) verbal techniques during The Dive, and switch off to focusing on my breath for The Immersion. Sometimes during Immersion, I will use the deeper level as an opportunity to do healing, by focusing the incoming energies on areas needing help. As well, during The Dive portion, if I have some specific goals in mind, I will incorporate some Hypnosis and NLP into the middle 10 minutes or so, just before it pushes down to Delta. I have also used the increased sense of energy flow to channel healing to others at a distance, using some of the techniques taught in SFQ.

What I have noticed from chatting with others using HS is that most of the ones lying down are either not feeling like they're getting anywhere, or they are experiencing inordinant amounts of overwhelm. I believe part of the reason for either of these has to do with the energy not flowing properly and being blocked.

As well, whether from not understanding just how powerful the mind is, or not truly wanting to become fully engaged in personal change, many people seem to think that if they just sit/lie there and listen, that's all the benefit they will derive. My personal experience is, that the more engaged you become in the experience while listening, the more you will also become engaged in the outer processes of expanding awareness and growing spiritually.

I have written extensively about how beneficial I feel HS has been in my life on the Centerpointe Forum (not directly related to the company). I am currently just started on Awakening Level 3, first CD. With approximately another 10 years left in the program, as I am an Inner Circle member, when I consider how far I've come in just a year and a half, I'm totally in awe of where this could lead over the next 10 years.

Cheers!
Unis

for some reason every time I tried meditating sitting down with my spine as straight as possible, my feet would begin to tremble and a numb sensation would come and would bother me and therefore I had to stop.

Any help on this? I began to meditate lying down because it was a lot easier on the back and on the feet.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by garics:

"After a few minutes ……. I can start to feel my whole frontal line as a column of circulating energy... From there the meditation becomes a process of comfortably maintaining the posture while allowing mind to clear and remain clear. There are sensations of releasing obstructions along my frontal line, while being anchored in the point below the navel. ...When I am really "into it", it is like I am not there, although I am at the same time, completely aware, even more aware than usual, of the present moment and of every sensation that arises."

~

Thanks for the reply. I cannot even begin to imagine what the above feels like. As I said at the very start of this post, I have never felt a thing doing Holosync and when I hear other users describing their experiences I can only think; hey wait a minute, what about me? What do I not feel that way too? Off course I do realise that I can only feel what is appropriate for me and that trying to feel the way others do is not what it is all about. But it would be nice to feel something, anything even.

On a different note, part of my problem may be my inability to sit in the way you describe due to various problems I experience with my knees etc. Sitting cross legged on the floor would be quite a discomfort for me due to immobility in the knee joint and problems with my cartilage etc; hence the reason lying down was always the easier option for me. I tried using a recliner once but even that caused a little discomfort, so as you can see in the end lying down became the easier option.

It may be that meditation and Holosync are just not for me. I have always believed that what works for one person does not necessarily mean that it will work for all, so there is no universal remedy in my world, no panacea in my opinion. Assuming this to be the case then I will just have to accept that fact and get on with living my life as fully as I feel I can.

Regards to you Garics
Stevie~

p.s. Of course being only human I do admit to more than a little frustration and disappointment that Holosync did not work for me.

hello anyone,

i'm new to this forum and was after a little help if possible. i have been using holosync for over 3 months (awakeing level) i have paid for the first level in jan 16th, and still havnt received my affirmation email? i have emailed twice and have been told the same on both occasions, that you will receive the affirmations email in 3-5 day??? has anyone else out there experienced any difficulty in this way? i do live in the uk and find the communication difficult to centrepointe. can anyone help me.
thank you
jane

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Unis:

....if I have some specific goals in mind, I will incorporate some Hypnosis and NLP....

Can I ask whether you are using a form of self hypnosis?

Regards
Steve

quote:

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Originally posted by Golden_Era:
for some reason every time I tried meditating sitting down with my spine as straight as possible, my feet would begin to tremble and a numb sensation would come and would bother me and therefore I had to stop.

Any help on this? I began to meditate lying down because it was a lot easier on the back and on the feet.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Golden_Era:
for some reason every time I tried meditating sitting down with my spine as straight as possible, my feet would begin to tremble and a numb sensation would come and would bother me and therefore I had to stop.

Any help on this? I began to meditate lying down because it was a lot easier on the back and on the feet.

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I apologize for the duplicate quote. Unis, Golden-Era, & Stevie-I just wanted to let you know that I found a device that helps me sit with proper posture - & without pain-while meditating. The meditation device is sold by Higher Balance Institute and cost $49.00. It is a rather simple device that will probably last for many many years. Before using this, after a short time of meditation, I would be in pain trying to maintain the proper sitting posture. I do not think this device is the solution for all "meditation sitting" problems-but might be worth a try for some of you. If interested in checking it out, this is their 800 number: (800-935-4007-Pacific Time Zone ) or website: www.higherbalance.com . I am sure Higher Balance could give you an idea, by phone, if the device might be of assistance for one's individual problem. I do not know if this particular item is refundable or not In the event that the device does not help you or your physician does not appove of you using it. Blessings-khalah

quote:

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Originally posted by Stevie:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Unis:

....if I have some specific goals in mind, I will incorporate some Hypnosis and NLP....

Can I ask whether you are using a form of self hypnosis?

Regards
Steve

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Yes, it is self hypnosis. What I do is to set an intention and choose a few key words to use during the meditation, somewhat as an affirmation or mantra. I've been doing trance work for over 25 years, so I have a good sense of when I reach certain depths.

Approximately 10 minutes into the Holosync entrainment, deeper alpha moving into Theta is experienced, and this, for me is the best place to push suggestions. This is also a good time to do visualization along with key word suggestions. That period lasts for approximately 10 minutes more, then dips into Delta entrainment, which is where one wants to be quiet, and allow the deeper entrainment to do its work.

Besides, by that time I'm in such a nice cozy, blissful place, I just don't want to be doing anything but being in that experience.

Cheers!
Unis

Further to much that has been said on this thread, I thought I would say that
I was using Holosync last night for the first time this year after a lengthy sabbatical from it.

I decided to use it sitting upright in an arm chair with my back and head reasonably well supported. I felt this would be better than using it lying down which was the way I used to do Holosync. I noticed though that while sitting upright I still fell asleep for much of the session. Nonetheless what I want to ask is whether sitting upright in the way that I have just described is a 'good enough' way to meditate. I guess there may not be a right way, but I feel lying down is certainly not the best method. Any comments or suggestion will be most welcome.

Regards
Steve

Hi Stevie:

From what I've been gathering from different discussions on the matter of "position while listening", you could probably stand on your head and benefit from the entrainment - by which I mean to say that as long as you are comfortable (and if you fell asleep you must have been), your body is relaxed and receptive, and therefore, as long as the earphones stay on your ears, you will be getting the entrainment effect.

I think the idea behind the "sitting position" relates to the flow of energy most dyed in the wool meditators consider optimal. From my own experience, most of the time I do holosync in a semi-lying down position in my recliner, and I definitely feel a good energy flow, as well as have experienced great results along the lines Bill Harris has expounded on in his writings. So I don't particularly consider there is any particular right way for position of body while using the Holosync program.

So, if you are comfortable while you meditate, regardless of position, it is right for you.

Don't be put off by falling asleep either. It could be since you used it in the evening you were tired enough to sleep. It could also mean that the entrainment is really working for you (regardless of any physical sensations), because if there is lots to clear up in the subconscious mind (and for most of us there is, or we wouldn't be seeking ways of making ourselves better), then "sleeping" is sometimes the best way for it to get the clearing process underway.

Did you notice if you had any dreams? I have found starting a new level, and even starting the lower level CD's within a level, I have increased dream activity for about a week - sometimes for the whole level. Dreams are often part of the process of clearing out "garbage" that's stuck in there.

My advice would be not to push yourself too hard on "listening" - do what is comfortable and gradually work your way into it again. Don't worry about your position or sleeping. Be comfortable. When you are ready to move forward to the next level, you will probably find you are staying awake, or waking more often during the sessions. I would also suggest keeping a diary, starting now, of where you are at in your life, and noting down anything that seems to come up for you, either from your daily thinking, or from your dreams, as this will be your guide as to whether or not Holosync is working for you. Many people don't experience physical sensations - and they still experience major shifts in their lives over time while using Holosync.

Cheers!
Unis

Hi Steve;

I'm currently on Purification 2. Somewhere around Awakening 2 I was having trouble with falling asleep while listening to HS and didn't really like it to much. At that time I was attracted to doing the Sedona Method which of course helped me release alot of stuff consciously at a much faster pace.

It was at this time I got the idea of "falling asleep" as a feeling and used the Sedona Method to release on it. It worked for me and the only days I fall asleep now is when I am physically exhausted it wouldn't matter what I did, I would fall asleep anyway.

In any type of meditation it takes that daily commitment to see the benefits over a long haul. Holosync is no different.

Up to Level 3 Awakening I was very suspicious that HS worked and then something released and all that went away. After Level 4 I noticed that when things took a bad turn, I could back up, sort of mentally reframe things and have them turn out much better, sometimes way way better. This was very subtle though, not like it happened over night. More like I discovered that I had this ability and it kept getting better.

Things still get better for me by continual listening. On Purification 1, I considered giving it up, and like many others just focus on Spring Forest Qigong. The big reason I did not is because what I have been doing,has been very successful for me and I did not want to change anything.

From where I was when I started HS things have definately been on a growth curve. Holosync does stimulate growth and consciously you also have to find answers to questions or obstacles as you go along.

Doing the Sedona Method was a really big help in the beginning and later on practicing Spring Forest Qigong also helped to pull your energy back together when having a bad hair day. You find many tools as you go along that help you in everyday life. No one book has all the answers. You don't repair a gas turbine using a garbage disposal manual. You find the answers by looking in the right place.

In my opinion, all this type of training does is to help expand ones consciousness and help you live in the moment, to manifest the reality you want in life. You have challenges that you must meet and overcome and this helps you grow. It is doing "the work".

I am half way through the HS program and look forward to completing it but am in no great hurry to do so.

Hope that helps

Jeff

Hi Stevie,
Looking back at your original post, I was just wondering if you had tried listening to the HS at a different time e.g. during the day - would that be at all possible - even while at work e.g. during lunch? Also, it sounds like your working day is really taking it out of you - do you get any chance to exercise at all? This might raise your energy levels in general and after you get home would help your state of mental alertness. Maybe you might try making other changes in your life including exercise such as diet, drinking more water, even using a loofah in the shower! There are lots of little ways to help raise your energy levels.

Putting Holosync to the side for a moment, what are the changes that you want to make in your life? Are there any practical things you could be doing to help effect those changes? Are there any other programmes you could be using to complement Holosync? Given the fact that you seem to be having most trouble trying to stay alert, perhaps SFQ Spring Forest Qigong could be a possible complementary programme, given its physical movement-based exercises (not so easy to fall asleep during!). I think someone mentioned it in an earlier post - but movement-based mediation might be something you could try during the day. Mindfulness meditation while, for example, doing something as basic even as walking in a park can be very effective. Yoga and Tai Chi are also examples of meditation in movement - and they would also actively improve your body's energy levels.

Otherwise, there are a number of other audio "self-hypnosis" CDs on the market which you might try or you could even go to an actual hyphotherapist for a couple of sessions and be guided through self-hypnosis techniques by him or her, in person.

There are lots of tools out there and lots of answers. Perhaps putting all of your eggs in one basket isn't working for you at the moment - but that might not be this particular basket's fault - perhaps you just need to try more baskets alongside this one!
Good luck and best wishes
Ingrid

Hi Ingrid

Thanks for your reply. As regards my work I work flexible working hours which means I choose to work from 7am till 5 pm. This effectively means I work five days in four, in other words I work a four day week and get every Friday off work. I also work Saturday and Sunday mornings. I say this only as I tend to agree with you in the sense that my working day does take a lot out of me, although I do enjoy my job.

Currently it would be impossible to use HS at any other time. I had considered using it in the morning, but I realised that would mean getting up even earlier which I did not want to do. It would also be difficult using it in the office I work in, not impossible, but difficult.

I appreciate your comments re diet. Food and diet is something I am very interested in and I do follow a fairly healthy diet compared to most of my fellow Scots! And surprise surprise I do use a loofah in the shower. I have to be honest though and say I do not get enough exercise and do not always feel as energetic as I would like to.

What changes do I want? It’s a good question. I guess I was attracted to HS as I felt it might help me in some of the difficult areas in my life. I am aware that I am a fairly tense and sometimes anxious individual, and I am also somewhat defensive at times, both towards people and the world in general. It is a bit like Bill says, the world was a real scary place for me as a child and dealt me a few bad hands and sometimes I feel I am replaying that original feeling over and over. I realise it does not have to be like that but then realisation is one thing while feelings are another.

I would also like that feeling of being able to go with the flow a bit more, to be able to reach out and not be afraid all the time, to take life as it is, to be able to take set backs on the chin and with a little luck to have the feeling of contentment being the main feeling in my life. The other benefits of meditation in general also made me feel HS would be worth the effort.

I realise that, as in most things in life, one has to make the effort. HS is no different as far as I am concerned. So I am not expecting it to be the magic wand that "solves" all my issues, I realise that I have to be prepared to help myself too, so to speak. But as I say I guess I was feeling quite frustrated that other people were describing all sorts of wonderful experiences with HS while I felt I was feeling nothing at all.

Regards
Stevie

All I can say about Holosync is positive. I've been using it for a year and am just concluding Awakening Level 2, disc 3. The changes to me have been profound. I am nearly 64 and had been on medication to control anger and depression for 10 years, following the death of my wife from Non-Hodgkisons Lymphoma. I am now off medication. My whole view of the world has changed. I am a peaceful and calm person. I question all the things I have taken for granted all my life and see the illusion. I have not missed a day of Holosync. I look forward to each session. When each new level is reached I sleep for most of the hour. By the end of the prescribed time on that level I am wide awake for the whole 60 minutes. This is not unusual for participants. In my opinion it doesn't matter if you sleep during sessions or not. when your nervous system becomes use to the level you are on, and you can stay awake without trying, lt's time to go to the next level...IF YOU HAVE COMPLETED THE RECOMMENDED TIME ON THAT LEVEL. Hasten slowly...and let it be OK! It is not an instant cure. The price to pay is an hour a day for years.

Unis

Your advice has been very helpful. I can make a few points in reply to your suggestions. First of all, when I realise I am going to do a session on Holosync whilst attempting to sit up straight, I instinctively feel that I cannot be bothered, I can almost feel my heart sink a little. It feels too much of an effort, a chore and something to get done and get it over with. There is little doubt in my mind that this approach to Holosync or meditation in general is probably not efficacious at all. It seems to me that one has to enjoy or look forward to or gain some form of satisfaction from whatever one is doing to make it worthwhile, meaningful and hopefully lasting.

Having said that when I decide to lie down to meditate I feel a lot happier although as I say I usually fall asleep and start to wonder whether I am acquiring the benefit that Holosync is trying to offer. Still I find that position the most relaxing, restful and far more pleasant that sitting. It is what I like and what I prefer. (I note though that there is a thread in this post stating that falling asleep during meditation is to be avoided as the purpose of mediation is to remain awake in order to focus tour consciousness.)

As regards your comment that most of us have a lot to clear up in our subconscious minds, without going into any great detail I can confirm that that is most definitely the case for me. I am also aware of a lot of resistance within myself, even when I want to change some things, and in many things in life I have to fight the tendency to give up too easily. I reckon my middle name should have been "what's the use?"

So for the time being when I use HS I am just going to use it as I please. You have given me the inspiration to do so.

Regards
Stevie

I'm on the 2nd level and have noticed a big difference between sitting up and using it or lying down. Have you tried it both ways? I always fall asleep when I get to a new level until my brain gets used to it. But even falling asleep you get benefits.

Also, I wonder if not seeing changes is part of your particular resistance. I found myself initially experiencing extreme irritibility with the first level, especially if I listend through 2 sessions. But irritibility was characteristic of me when I experienced overwhelm. Maybe this is a kind of characteristic of yours? I have experienced changes. One major change was an increase in memory and another was increased peripheral vision. Because Bill Harris talked about LSC I was willing to try photoreading which I am just now learning. Because of Holosync, I feel my brain is amply primed for the connections that happen with activation. We shall see. IN any event, holosync feels good to me now, almost like a brain massage. I can feel it working and I never miss a day. Keep emailing their support staff. And if you really feel it hasn't worked for you, ask for your money back and invest in something like SFQ or other tehnique.

What difference did you notice? I assume sitting up was better for you rather than lying down. My problem is that sitting up is very uncomfortable and when I know I am going to do a session sitting up I do not look forward to it, in fact I positvely hate it and I know I will not be committed enough to continue in that fashion. Certainly I haven't noticed any changes in me and I started Holosync in August 2004, although I have had a break over the last four months or so.

There does seem to be divided opinion on this. Some people have said sitting up is the optimum way whilst lying down is to be avoided, others have said it does not matter if you lie down. I do find it confusing and admit to being a bit downhearted about Holosync at times.

I do not doubt that there is a lot of resistance in me but identifying that restistance isn't always easy. Sometimes I realise it is there right in front of me but it can be quite subtle too. In my experience resistance is by its nature sometimes well camouflaged and identiifying it and dealing with it can be difficult. And then dealing with resistance itself could become a method of resisting.....

Yes I do feel that not seeing changes of any sort is a resistance on my part. I am aware of a part of me that operates that way, it is hard to put into words, but giving up, self defeating, feeling sorry for myself, wanting others to feel that way when nothing works all spring to my mind.

Regards
Stevie