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#48687 10/13/02 12:41 PM
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Hi,

I was wondering if it's ok to practice Yoga postures (Hatha) with Qigong, or would there be a "energy technique" clash? Thanks.

Diana


#48688 10/14/02 07:08 PM
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Diana,

I don't presume to know the answer to this, but based on my own experience there is no problem. I have even experimented with doing some asanas immediately before and after the SFQ. I feel like I maintain the energy longer if I do the SFQ after the yoga.

I am referring to simple Hatha Yoga without pranayama. The methods employed in the breathing and intention while doing pranayama might conflict with SFQ, although an advanced practicioner could probably integrate them.

Michael


#48689 10/15/02 03:59 PM
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Amstar:
How do you do Hatha Yoga (the asanas or poses) without incorporating pranayama (the breathing techniques)? I thought both goes together with proper form and technique. Otherwise, you are just doing regular exercises or stretching. Yes, pranayama can be done by itself; but, hatha yoga requires the proper use (or control) of the breath to achieve the ultimate benefit. Then, again, even sitting still to do pranayama is considered an asana (hatha yoga); in fact, this is the ultimate asana and the highest form of hatha yoga: to hold an asana, such as one of the advanced sitting asanas.

There are different breathing techniques used or recommended by different yoga teachers and even in the ancient literature. Some are similar and some different to SFQ. The practice of yoga is an energy system in and of itself; and, as such, when done properly could interfere with the SFQ energy movement. Not that one is good and one less good; it is just like climbing the mountain from different locations and using different vehicles (which is fine), but not if you expect to do both at the same time.

A better approach might be to have a couple of hours rest between doing the different echniques. For example doing one in the morning and the other midday, or something like that.

After 25 years of yoga practice, I still regularly practice yoga. I, also, enjoy and have richly benefitted from SFQ (both the active exercises and the meditation techniques). I, personally, find them to be very much complimentary. However, I don't practice them in tandem.

The practice of yoga takes me into the silence (as Master Lin would call it) and I do not need to re-enter the door, having already entered within. The practice of SFQ takes me into the silence; and, again, I do not need to re-enter this door having already entered within. Both are very powerful: different paths up the same mountain.

I have found the energy movement, patterning and ordering of both to be somewhat different, in a nice kind of way. The easiest and quickest of the two, for me, is SFQ - definately. SFQ (active exercises) is what I'd call a standing or walking meditation, and it accomplishes the job effectively, efficently and quickly. Why? You are using all of your faculties (mind through concentration, body through movement, emotions through smiling and relaxing, and the breath through its breathing technique) simultaneously to sort of trick the mind and go beyond the mind into the silence: it is a multi-faceted assault, and it wins the battle (excuse the violent terminology). I find SFQ more natural and easier, but this is my opinion.

I would say you can practice both and benefit, but try to space them adequately - at least. Remember Master Lin's admonition about mixing energy systems. Some yoga techniques (asanas and pranayamas) might be complimentary and some others less so: there are so many different types now, as is also true for qigong in general.
Love and Light


#48690 10/16/02 02:55 PM
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Amstar,

You say you practice both yoga and SFQ? Wouldn't you then be mixing energy techniques? Master Lin mentioned that this shouldn't be done. I'm just intersted in stretching not so much as breathing. I'm confused now...

[This message has been edited by Mayflower (edited October 16, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by Mayflower (edited October 16, 2002).]


#48691 10/16/02 04:52 PM
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I practise both, not at the same time. Master Lin also said, energy is energy.

#48692 10/16/02 11:31 PM
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Gallen, you have nothing to add?

#48693 10/17/02 12:31 AM
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Diana,

I think Macook described it well by saying that they are, "different paths up the same mountain."


And yes, Macook, can be just like "regular stretching," however passive, sustained stretching also requires proper breath control. When I do it the emptiness and energy flow are the focus, as well as exploring the limits of how far I can stretch my limbs. Now then, does that get the label of Yoga? It is very difficult to know what a person means by Yoga since it has been so westernized.

Ultimately everything is energy, all we are working with is our intent.

So Diana, try doing both, pay attention and if you still feel unsure, then I would recommend choosing the one that you like better and stick with it. You will benefit either way.

Michael


#48694 10/17/02 07:02 AM
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Mayflower,
You are not confused; and, we appologise for any unintentional confusion. You mention that you're just interested in stretching. Stretching is fine. Stretching is good and beneficial; and, yoga asanas offers benefits in the area of stretching. This you may experiment with, and I'm sure you'll enjoy the results. I don't think you'll have any problem incorporating stretching and/or other physical exercises, in addition to SFQ, into your program for healthful living.

Amstar seems to have found a nice balance for combinding the two: yoga stretching and SFQ. I like the way Amatar mentions "breath control" while focusing on the "emptiness" and "energy flow." Sounds like you've found one other way of taking the techniques of SFQ out into other areas of your life. Very good, because qigong is not merely a static system. One does not have to be overly focused on the individual nuances of the techniques, to the point of being stressed. Rather, relax and enjoy the process: the "now" of the experience. With regular practice and in time all will come together as it should - the breathing, the relaxation, the silence, the movements, the balance, the energy, and the synergy of all the parts.

However, we should remember that Master Lin has given us a complete and very powerful system. For best results, we would be best served by not diluting the system or inappropriately mixing it with other potentially, incompatible, energy techniques. Master Lin has put this system together after many years of extensive practice and experiential knowledge. Therefore, I think it might be best to stay closer to the practice Master Lin has given.

In my earlier comments concerning yoga, I was referring to yoga in the classical sense: as a science of life, a path to awakening. I was not referring to the mere stretching or gymnastic, or arobicizing [my word] aspects (althought nothing is wrong with these types of yoga, if that is what one is after). Looking at yoga from this classical sense it is very much an energy system. Therefore one would be best served to follow Master Lin's admonition and not mix energy systems, any old way. Yes it can be done, and I do it, but better to space them. That is partly what I was trying to say.

We are the benefactors of a magnificent system of qigong (SFQ). Let us enjoy the practice and reap the wealth of benefits it offers.... One day you too might become a master, and....

Anyone knows where our beloved Gallen is off to? Already miss his input.


#48695 10/17/02 02:05 PM
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Thank you Macook, beautifully said. Gallen's mother is ill. He mentioned his postings would be sporadic. I hope she's ok.

Diana


#48696 10/17/02 03:42 PM
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Mayflower,

Thanks for the update on Gallen.

I pray, "Oh infinite Lord thou knows better than I that which Gallen's mother needs. And, it for this and this alone that I pray. I beseech thee to bring it into her life swiftly, surely and most harmoniously."

Gallen, I wish you and your mother all the best. I'll remember you both in my prayers and meditations.

Love, light, peace and divine bliss....


#48697 10/21/02 07:54 PM
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Hi,
I have been travelling , and very busy with personal things and work. I have been practicing alot, and I am feeling the need for more quiet. This is not an intellectual decision, it is just happening. We are also moving into the winter season. I am being led this way, nothing to do with my previous feelings questioning my posts. I'm around... Thank you for the prayers and kind thoughts. My mother is not doing well, but I am sure you all have your families and challenges too, and I send my love to you also.
It is ok to do yoga and qigong, but as I may or may not state well enough later in this post, there are other things I mention later, that are more important. That said, it is better to practice them at different times, if it is a complete, in depth cycle of experience, although, it then gets into time restrictions, and whether or not you are honoring either method with an "alternation" of routine. It is a tall order to master any one thing, let alone two things. How much time do you have? Sometimes one system "can" provide a puzzle piece, or stretch, to release something you've needed to release, or help you move through a stage of development, or contribute greater understanding or experience of something. If you are more advanced, you can figure this out, what's right.... If you are a beginner in these things, pick one thing and learn it, don't dilute your beginning practice. You won't miss the boat. It is best to have a foundation in something. Very advanced practice gets back to simpilicity, returns to basics, moves towards emptiness. You 'can' just immerse in one thing and reach the same end. If you are a good person, and are "doing the work" so to speak, you move in the same direction as the masters. The rate of progress or "how high" the level, can be great accomplishment, but moving in the right direction is 'most' important, and you are all doing that.
It is always helpful to call on the master's energy. This is 'your' connection for whatever you decide to practice. It supports your self empowerment. If you decide to pursue some yoga, that is fine. Better ,if you bring in the master's energy to help you do it in a healing way, for you. Or , ask your master in the first place. Some meditation...This gift of awareness concerning the master's energy, is from Master Lin to you. A type of energy to bring in. A connection to go to. a process.. Be aware and respectful of that source of process, even if you are doing other things. It is meant to be connected to all the time. It ties your experiences together on a spirital level. You operate on a higher level. "It invokes a higher level of guidance." Make your decisions through this relationship, and trust it. It is your own personal connection to wisdom, and the master's energy helps you to learn from what ever you are choosing to do, or guided to do, and safeguards how you integrate it. In my own experience, 'I practice qigong', even, if I incorporate some yoga sourced stretching. I also practice a 'type' of qigong, even if I am doing some other exercise. It is an alignment that determines this. I always bring in the master's energy. Align with the same source. It is more a choice of what high level source one chooses to align with. I see this alignment, more as defining what type of qigong you do. Even if it expresses itself through SFQ. What is SFQ? Just a set of exercises? I don't think so. Someone focusing more on yoga, may do the same in reverse, liking some qigong information, but aligning with their yoga path or master as they integrate something, temporarily , or more permanently. I do think as one heals, and the body's physical health gets in balance, it gets back to doing less "things" , and more emptiness, probably best experienced in simple meditation. I think we tend to flail around a bit with all the great offerings out there, and often 'intellectually divert our progress'. Great Taoist wisdom, " the mind is still, when the spirit is in control. the mind is active, when knowledge dwells in it." I love that one. I gotta go, I hope I was coherent, I just got off the plane! I helped my seat mate, whom I didn't know. She was nervous about flying, and ended up holding her airsick bag. I had her do some simple breathing, and got her out of her nervous thoughts, which was affecting her stomach. So many people need help out there. Practice your qigong . Spread the wealth.

#48698 10/21/02 08:17 PM
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oh, Michael,,,,about the three pure ones...
I am still working on it! Three did come out of nothing in this sequence or way.. I don't know the order, or detail of event. The yin energy and yang energy emerged (two), and their integration, the tai chi (as in tai chi symbol), was regarded as the 'three', from one source I encountered. How this three and the three pure ones relate, I don't know. I am working on it! They both connect to truth, and are at the same level of subtle energy emergence relative to the Wuchi. It's good not to have all the answers. I may ask Master Lin about this sometime..., but, for now, I enjoy the questions...

#48699 10/21/02 08:59 PM
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Gallen! Good to see you're doin' ok.. Thank you, as always for the input on Yoga and SFQ. I was actually looking at Yoga as a exercise for stretching, not enlightenment. I hadn't planned on doing it the same time as SFQ.

Everyone here, has been so nice. If you all would like to see what I look like, check out my profile on yahoo. (I just like to know who I'm talking to, so if you have pics posted, let me know) I'm Celestialsecrets. You'll like my favorite quote..

Have a great day!

Diana


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