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Seems. Very important word there. That indicates to me that there is a part of you that knows, or suspects, that it really isn't magic.

There may very well be magic. Really. I don't say that sarcastically. There well may be something that functions so much like magic that we might as well call it that.

There have been unlikely situations I've witnessed. Horribly bad, incredibly good. Things that make you say, "Holy crap!" But is it magic?

Trust in God and tie up your camels, they say. When a person goes out into danger and rescues a person, that is amazing. It's wonderful. And yet there are times when people die alone and afraid. There are times when people go into immense danger, drunk and unprepared, and miraculously nothing bad happens to them. Then there are people who do everything they can and meet with tragedy.

It all figures into a big picture, as far as I am concerned. So, when someone says, "Magical," many times I think, "Hardly." Of course, there are times when the way I feel around a person is magical. Beauty can arouse feelings of magic in me, certainly. But that is just a romantic way of speaking. There was one woman I went out with who was absolutely stunning. One could say that she held a spell over me, and to an extent, she did. But, of course, we all know about the little chemicals and physical processes involved in that. It doesn't make the experience feel any less grand and mythic. It's nice to be able to say, "wait a minute, my brain is being pickled in hormones!" when you need to. It helps sober one up.

I understand your point about appreciating those who help you along the way. It's a good thing. You are more gracious about it in this context than I, and I think that is a good trait of yours.

Personally, however, I cannot not disagree. I cannot, will not stay silent on certain issues. I feel, in my own system of morality, that it would be wrong to do so. They should be exposed in an open forum and given air. If people think they stink, then that's their right. It probably all boils down to taste, anyway.

Paul is selling a bill of goods that I just can't buy wholesale. And I actually think there is something wrong with it. He has a right to his point of view. He has a right to say it. He has the right to sell it. Luckily, I have a right to give my opinions. Kudos to him for having these forums up and allowing me to say what I want to say here.

Regarding beliefs and perceptions, beliefs pretty much are perceptions. What else could they be? Your beliefs are perceptions you have had that influence perceptions you are making.

You can operate on perceptions. There's a bit of ambiguity with the term operate. You can function with your perceptions. You can also manipulate your perceptions. We're in sticky territory here, because I think we would both need to define in detail what we mean when we say belief and perception so we can be sure we're talking about the same things.

In any case, I suppose, symbolically, you can throw a belief in the garbage, but I think that this way of interacting with beliefs does not respect the ways beliefs are formed and what not. My feeling on that is kinda how I feel about a lot of Tony Robbins stuff. He gives people these half-baked explanations of things, and they go off willy nilly trying to muck with people's brains with no real understanding of what they're doing or conception of ecology. Meh.

Anyway, your persistent good will is winning over my curmudgeonly irascibility. I wish you the best, too.







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there is always more to things than we know
like a ocean the mind has great waves
we try to do many things to it
think of the effect that has on water

do u people understand me when i say things?
im a lightweight but do u undestand?
ive got terrible grammar and spelling i know
im doing my best
just no comments on what i had to say thats all i was wondering if it was read or if it was too long
feedback is nice
thanx






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Babayada;

In a mechanical sense I think of perceptions as feedback to a direction I am going. Of course sitting still in quietness of mind doesn't give you much fresh perceptions but it does unload alot of garbage.

Alot of times my daughters ask me questions why I am doing something. A good one was on Feng Shui, I probably bought every book on Feng Shui and played with all these different systems and came up with something that worked for me. My youngest daughter asked why I did that. I answered her "For Good Luck" which she looked at me with this most incredulous look. No way, she said. But I notice that she always sits in my chair, I notice that the whole family sits in that area of the house and when we have company they all gravitate to that spot.

It's just an energy thing like electricity that you can't hold in your hand. I say it's magic because it is easier to explain to someone with a short attention span. I know I spent alot of hours reading, meditating, asking Masters for guidance, feeling how it felt, etc. It was like planting a garden except I was looking for a space that created that Dragon Breathe or cosmic breathe that is an enviroment that gives health, long life, wealth success prosperity,
happy family, etc.

The big secret to all of it was that it gives you all of these things so that you find Happiness, the next step is to Enjoy your Happiness. Enjoy a fantastic love life, etc.

If you break it down it's like making a magnetic field using the right ingredients.
But the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts. Maybe that is the magic part, at least for me.

As far as information, I learned it that a Sensei can only teach what he knows. You cannot try and teach something you don't know or you will look like an idiot, and that has even deeper implications.

If you have a problem with some of the information, maybe Paul has a way of looking at it that makes it work right, otherwise, why would he teach it?

For me Perceptions are external information coming in. My Beliefs are like Operating policy and I act this way or that based on what I receive through my perception. My Values are broad and general that keep me in the right sectors of life, sometimes I have to define them more and more. My Goals are targets that I go after to enhance my Value system which is pretty much my life.

When you are more than the sum of your parts then that is the magic of life. It is the Dragon Breathe. It is being in harmony with your environment and having the whole Universe at your back to help you.

also I rather enjoy calling something magic when it is something that I don't want to take the time to figure out. I also use it to get my daughters to figure out if Dad is telling them another sailor story or not.

"Did you know the Great Pumpkin will be arriving soon?, Now he is really magic."
They have to go find out that the Great Pumpkin is from Charlie Brown and I will hear all these groans and laughs when they discover the truth. Now I have to go find one they don't know.

Prana;

Yes I did read your long notes. Waves are throughout the Universe, we probably are a wave. Sound waves, brain waves, ocean waves, pulses, rythems, the quiet is only an opening for the next wave. The wave creates change that keeps us fresh, healthy and clean. I'm rather fond of those Waves from nice girls with a smile attacted.

Jeff






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lol great
i couldnt read it in any time fast
speedreading ive done so far has not brung me very far
i do not think i have done it properly with enough effort
i know i can and will but geting over the hurdles is my challenge
staying without doubt is another
it is hard
but that is life right?
im trying ever so hard but i find myself distracted by my amazement of life and everything in it
i just cannot settle on one thing
ive been meditating but i cannot seem to get past certain points with that now
i get back to other things
i guess it is hard having so much information at my fingertips
i need somewhere to be
without all of this so i have no choice to just pick up a book or start a conversation
i guess a few of u can do the speed/photo reading thing

i WILL get there
ill listen to the subliminals 10 times in a row before i get into doing the course again
im pretty alert and i do not need as much sleep as most people so i can do things for a long period of time but i come to few conclusions
ive got 140+ IQ though i do not really excell in any one area
and ive said my mathematics really brings me down
i have a thirst for life while i am here and i will not live another
this is the last
but i still have some time to go
i have seen my own death
in my sleep but fully aware of it so i wake up and go outside and lye down to look at the stars then it all fades
there is no more past that
people would think im crazy if i told them half the things i am telling here
though some still will here lol
thats totally fine with me

i think this manifestation is sound
created from the first thought that wanted form
im not sure how to explain it all yet but there is something in the brain that creates sound when you think
ill work it all out one day
matter changes with the sound
we can morph with enough mental ability

im just ridin the wave though i might just be one of the many
not all are on the same wave though
the length varies aswell






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Prana;

You are right about your thoughts but in my humble opinion you need to just relax and ride the wave as far as it will take you. Nothing lasts forever. But here and now can be forever.

I was taught also that the Universe began with a sound, it was the sound of Soooo.
The phrase "So What" was kind of a joke on creating the Universe. "So" the Universe was created and "What!" big surprise!

Enjoy being Happy it is a path with all the rewards you could ever dream of.

Jeff






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Toh-may-toh, toh-mah-toh. Poh-tay-toh, poh-tah-toh.

Lets call the whole thing off.









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im enjoying it alright
i enjoy every moment like a child
even Jesus was right about some things
he was a good MAN






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Prana, you MUST be be enjoying the discussion!

"even Jesus was right about some things
he was a good MAN"????

My goodness! Those sound like fighting words!! *grin*

I won't engage you in verbal battle, but I'll lend you my flak jacket if you need it for other responses.






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hmm perhaps
but he was right about it either way if he existed wholly god or half man-half god or just wholly man
either way he was right yeah?
i enjoy discussion a lot
i like to talk to people see what they think and know
not a competeting but just to see others opinions
which are not always good but sometimes even shine through the bad
i guess i do the same
don't ask me which is which thats for you to decide on
i need no protection from words
i may have in the past but i no longer do
im good with difference
and i know there is change and if someone is just getting it very wrong and it is harmfull even i know it an change for worse or better
the heart knows where to follow
one of the greatest challenges of opoinions is that others believe yopu are simply trying to overcome them not just be there
like government they do not always agree but they are there either way
some just love being the opposition

benewme engage if you see the need
ive no fear
do you? lol i cannot see what for
challenge me if you can
i think u see it too far below you
not trying to egg you on now
the more things are kept in the dark the more they are doomed to stay there and the further from light they become






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Going way off topic here. Remember this is about the Abundance for Life course. If you want to continue your discussion Prana I suggest you continue it in the beyond human forum where it belongs.

This thread is long enough without moving further off topic.

Paul's question was aimed at giving you something to look within yourself for as you do the Abundance for Life course. And personal insights were offered and they are all true given the personal experiences and knowledge obtained by the individuals.

Take only your own experience as your answer and as you continue to explore and ask that question again and again the answer will change. There will never be one answer, only personal experiences and those who consider the question when the do the Feeling Exercise are bound to notice some personally profound answers but like the feeling exercise once you put it into words you have changed it... don't try to analyse the experience while you were having it because that takes you out of it. Those moment were you see the answer are always followed by a return to the trance state. We never get fully out of our trances but we can experience transformation along the way.

Alex






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